OK UPDATE<
With the 1.3 rom on it's own in bay 2 work's fine, see pic, all done on the 1.3 on it's own only, with use of left mouse button to kick over to the 1.3 in bay 1,
Printable View
OK UPDATE<
With the 1.3 rom on it's own in bay 2 work's fine, see pic, all done on the 1.3 on it's own only, with use of left mouse button to kick over to the 1.3 in bay 1,
ok this is crazy its 7AM doing this thing, ok completed test 2.0 in both rom bay 1 and 2 here's picture's one picture show's software failure that is because night breed is a 1.3 game and had to kickstart 1.3 the 2.0 to get it to work for nightbreed,
starting to think there's a conflict issue with the rom's incompatible, or they are both trying to access the same part,
OK,
After some sleep, things become clearer....
If the 1.3 ROM and the 2.0 ROM work fine on their own but don't play together, then the answer is in the bank switching of the ROMs.
A 512k ROM (KS 2.0) needs the high bank enabled to see the whole ROM, whereas you only need the lower bank enabled for a 1.3 ROM, as it fits into the lower bank of the ROM and the upper bank is effectively blank.
Whatever this ROM switcher is doing is not changing the upper/lower bank address line, so that the machine can 'see' a 1.3 ROM when a 2.0 ROM is also present. This tells me that it's likely that a track is connected between the two sockets that shouldn't be, as the address is still being held high with a 1.3 ROM installed on it's own and this is becomes apparent when a 2.0 ROM is installed, i.e. the 2.0 ROM is tying the address line low at all times and the jumper wire is cancelled out.
OK, I have a wierd idea that might explain it.
Is there a circuit track on the ROM switcher that is connecting the two pins 21 on the sockets? If so, the answer may be that the track needs to be cut, to allow high/low address bit switching. You wouldn't need to cut this track with 3.1 and 2.0 ROMs, but you do need to do it to be able to use 1.3 ROMs.
One way would be to ground pin 21 on the 2.0 ROM with the leg lifted and tie pin 21 to pin 1 on the 1.3 ROM with the leg lifted, so that they definitely are set to high/low respectively and no contact is made between the sockets.
@ Zetr0
Does this seem like a reasonable argument as to how to solve this, without cutting tracks on the switcher?
We need to get tbtorro into this thread, to see if he can advise about any issues with these switchers and rev 8A boards.
Guys, I would love to help but I'm not an expert on the complex details of this and I dont have an A500+ to test it. All I can say that the ROM switchers were initially tested on an A500 Rev 6A motherboard and worked fine. I haven't had any issues from anyone about incompatibility on any of the systems.
So I can offer these after pucca4466 sends back the ROM switch:
Option 1> if faulty in my A500 he will receive a replacement asap.
Option 2> if working he can choose to have it back or get a full refund.
tbtorro, you answered it right there my friend it was tested on a rev 6A most of the amiga's out there are either rev 3/5/6, i found out on a web site that the amiga 500+ rev 8A was advanced system, meaning its super to the 3/5/6 amig'a i dont have any jumper's they have been removed, the board look's nothing like any of the other board's even the rom spot is further down the board then previous amiga's, this will show the evolution of the mother board if you look closely to the chip's and other component's you will notice they have been moved and altered to advance the machine,
http://amiga.resource.cx/exp/search....&company=#a500
also tbtorro. to me i think the card may be fine as it switches when there's no rom in bay 2 so it's either as merlin said there's a track on pin 21 or an incompatibility between rom's. will check the switcher for a track between the 2 rom's on pin 21 and take pics if i can get close enough, not your fault tbtorro,
update on switcher,
theres on track at rear of board going to pin 21 and one on the front that look's like it link's both rom's and gos to the chip, look very close at picture's,
@Pucca4466
Have you got a multimeter, to be able to check if both pin 21s on the sockets are interlinked? Even a battery and a bulb or LED would do.
If the sockets are linked together on Pin 21, then cutting that track should solve it, as the 1.3 will be tied high by the connection to pin 1 and pin 21 on the other would be low by default.
yep got a voltage meter will check and see if i get connection across but will need to know what track as there's 2 tracks go to pin 21. thats why i said you need to look at pic's carefuly, and other pics of full board so you can get better idea of switcher,
got a circuit right across both rom's on pin 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by pucca4466
if you look at the pic 1 in this post you will see there's a single track goe's between pin 21 on both rom's behind the switcher is another track, the only possible way to do this is to cut the track on rom 2, as to cut the track behind or on rom 1 they will both be still connected, ?
OK, next question.
With the 1.3 ROM installed in the switcher in the position that works, what voltage do you get across pins 1 and 11 of the ROM chip? Pin 1 will be positive and pin 11 negative for connecting the voltmeter.
You will either get a voltage or you won't, it's a black or white situation. My gut instinct tells me you will get a voltage, as this would tie the address bit for the lower 256k of the ROM to high and this is why the 1.3 ROM works.
If you do get a voltage, then pin 1 of the 1.3 ROM is set to data high and we need to lift pin 1 of the 2.0 ROM, to set it's address bit low.
If I am right about this, then if you bend pin 1 of the 2.0 ROM out slightly (so that the pin won't plug into the socket when you insert it) then both ROMs should work.
on DC V it read's 2.2V between pin 1 and 21
---------- Post added at 20:12 ---------- Previous post was at 20:09 ----------
Im now going to take pin 1 on the 2.0 rom and bend it out so it dosn't make contact on the rom bay or any pin's,
OK, so there is voltage tying pin 1 (A17) high. Bend pin 1 of the 2.0 ROM out slightly so that it doesn't plug into the socket when you insert the chip.
Fit both ROMs and try it. This should work, as A17 is then low for the 2.0 ROM as there's no voltage to pin 1.
going to test rom to boot up here's picture's of the rom pin 1 bent,
WOW DIDN'T LIKE THAT!!:o big red screen nope don't think its that
Is that a red screen with a reset or not?
the 1.3 ROM should still work, unless something really screwy is at work here.
cough wow bright!!!
from power up soon as the power hit's it red screen
Hmm....
Carefully bend the pin back and let me open my 500 Plus. It's not an auto ROM switcher, but it will give us a clue as to what should be connecting to where.
well like i said before if it won't take this auto but will take manual switch id swap for that, people have to understand this is the last revision, REV 8A, not rev 6 or rev 5 or rev 3,
Which socket did you have the 2.0 ROM in, was it ROM 1? If so, I suggest that you switch the ROM 2.0 to position 2 and try it again with pin 1 lifted on the 2.0 chip.
The default setting is supporting the 1.3 ROM, so that needs to be ROM 1. When you CTRL-L_Amiga-R_Amiga the voltage to pin 1 will drop and the ROM 2.0 should kick in.
The red screen is shows because it's trying to access halfway though the 2.0 ROM, i.e. only seeing 256k of the 512k ROM.
If you still get a red screen, lift pin 21 and restore pin 1 of the 2.0 ROM then try that.
i have tried the rom's both way, when 2.0 is in bay 1 and 1.3 in bay 2 they give the same effect straight red screen, by default the rom switcher gos to rom 2, i will life the pin 21 on 2.0 and place in rom 1 and the 1.3 in rom 2 and see what happen's.
ok here's result, blank screen and that's how the rom's were placed
failed again, pin 1 and pin 21 rom chip in either bay,
well put my machine back together it's been in bit's for to many day's and i just feel this revision of board is designed to not take rom switcher's, so ill sell my auto switcher if any one want's it with the 1.3 rom working, decided ill buy a 1.3 500 machine instead,
(Gutted) so we know it's either impossible for REV 8A for auto, or it's incompatible)
but will work fine on REV 6A, it dos work before any one ask. i can switch between port's so this think is fine, before any one ask!.
@ Pucca
If you are going to sell it, you need to state a price.
The answer to this must be staring us both in the face, but I am :censored: if I can see it. I'm determined to crack this one though and depending on the price, I might just buy this myself, to solve this puzzle, as it's started doing my head in now...:nuts:
:lol:
replied in pm,
going back to some thing you said, that a 3.0 should work along side the 2.0 rom. I have my 1200 rev 10.4 sat doing nothing, later tomorow ill give it a try in the rom bay 1 and see what happens on it's own,, idea being if the 1.3 might be the reason it's having issue's may be the 3.0 might work,
read on a web site there's to much work involved to get it the recognise the 3.0 think i will sleep on it, and hope i don't bend any of the pin's lol get it sleep on it? :huh: ok never mind, (not bother trying 3.0 in my machine)
for all those who have followed this post, you will know merlin and me (pucca4466) have tried load's of different combination's to get the rev 8a amiga 500+ to recognise the both rom's without going through a disco routine with the TV. im just waiting to see if merlin wont's the switcher, if so then i believe this kind gentlemen is going to give it more test's to see why it won't split the 2 rom's when in the switcher on the REV 8A, as we know it will work fine no problem's on REV 6A amiga 500 - 500+, so i hope merlin will post the answer's here for everyone, or update as or when there's a breakthrough, :):thumbsup:
(clap!) one more added bit, would like to thank merlin for his hard effort in hunting round the web trying to help find an answer and phone call,,, (clap) :thumbsup::bowdown:
(clap!) now a big thank you to my self who also ran round the web and did the hand's on getting dirty with the rom chip's and testing of the switcher, ( clap!)
zzzzzZZZZ's sleep time night night!!
@ Pucca
The A1200 uses a pair of ROMs and they aren't compatible with the A500/600/2000. There are version 3.1 ROMs out there for the A500/600/2000 on a single ROM chip though. I think Amigakit still stock them.
One thing that should work 100% to get Night Breed working on your 2.04 A500 Plus; I suggest that you look up a floppy disk called Relokick, as this will work and will run a lot of software that only runs under Kickstart 1.3.
It was given away on a magazine coverdisk, so it is in the public domain. Aminet may have it and if it doesn't, I'm pretty certain that the FTP site over at EAB will have it.
I'll be in touch about the switcher after Boxing Day if that's OK. :thumbsup:
hi merlin, no problem on switcher :thumbsup:,
i have
2.0 kickstart
1.3 relokick
3.0 X nope not cleaver enough lol.
previous post i did on here with the screen saying software failure, was because id forgot to put the 1.3 kick before the disk, so had to back track and install that first to make sure the system still booted up,
had spoke to this lady down south she is selling a 500 and 500 + with 200 game's, when i asked how much she wanted, here reply was its very rare not many of the machine about mine's the only one's left, (by this time peeing my self with laughter :D ) a lot of price, and a lot of postage, good bye don't let the door hit ur arss on the way out, :Doh: nerve of some people,
so ill try ebay instead,
wouldnt mind i got mine with 3 external drive's 123 game's 3 joypad's x-copy with dongle, and other bit's for cheap price including postage,
-----------so till update after boxing day will call this on hold this post---------