1084S monitor fried tonight *(

My beloved 1084S broke tonight :cry:

I was playing about with my newly-purchased GVP DSS8+ that I received today,
I nipped to get some dinner and when I came back:

• black screen
• High-pitched whining
• No LED

This is where shouts of 'busted flyback' resound at every twist and turn of my google searches.

I'm gutted. Love that monitor.
I have my Amiga 1200 and my C64 hooked up to it and made a special Luma/Chroma cable for my c64.
The colours and sharpness were fantastic until this happened tonight. Not one thing wrong with it in the 3 years since I aquired it from a very careful, original owner.

I'm not sure what the repair cost would be, assuming I can find anyone to try and repair it in the Sheffield/Yorkshire area.
But if I buy another then it's life expectancy may not be long either.
Is there anyone that could advise on a possible repair solution in my area?

I'm quite nervous about opening it up and doing any repair work myself. Last year I soldered an audio cable onto the speaker terminals of the inside of a TV and got a very nasty shock when I touched the jack lead end when going to plug it into my mixer :oops: Shouldn't really admit that but :whistle:

As it stands I can't use my Amiga now... I've got a Blizzard mkIII 30/50 winging it's way to me too :(

I use a 22" widescreen LCD monitor (DVI and VGA only) with my PC but I don't think there is a solution for me to connect both my C64's and my Amiga to it and have perfect sync, resolution and colours.

I'll stop whining now... wish my 1084S would dammit!

Jimladd

People always jump on the 'broken flyback' bandwagon on these
monitors, but in all the years i've been repairing them
i've rarely seen a bad flyback. If it is one of these 1084's:
http://www.amiga-resistance.info/download_photos/1084S-P_1.JPG
It's quite common for the PSU board to develop a fault which
causes the whining noise you've got.
If you get stuck, i could repair it for you but you'd need to ship
it to Bristol; or i could offer a refurbished exchange unit, I
have a whole selection of various 1084 monitors available.
If you do want to try and repair it yourself, the PSU board is quite easy to remove. I have spare PSU boards available also (but i'd want your faulty/suspect one sent back to me)

Thanks hikey.

Car - ~£45 petrol
Train return - £73 :wooha:
Royal Mail - £40 (I don't have tons of faith in careful delivery of a fragile and heavy monitor).
hmmm.
PSU option sounds like it's the winner, even though there's no guarantee that's the prob.
Will PM you.
Thank you.

I'm in the flyback bandwagon, as my Daewoo unit simply died on me. At least the LOPT is cheap here.

In Europe HR charges an arm and a leg for it (maybe another internal organ too).:(

BTW: most of the time the problem is related to bad capacitors on the power supply area, then the flyback itself and at last the horizontal circuit (transistor & 1mH choke coil).

Just thought I'd add about the whining:

• Switch the power on and there is a high-pitched whine.
• When you switch the power button to off the high-pitched whine takes 11 seconds to wind down (high to low pitch) to silence. It sounds just like a high-pitched air-raid siren winding down.

My vote is a fried HOT.
My 1084S suffered the same fate last week, I'm going to replace the HOT as soon as I find some time for it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by UberFreak

My vote is a fried HOT.
My 1084S suffered the same fate last week, I'm going to replace the HOT as soon as I find some time for it.

---

What's a HOT?
A something, something transistor?

the HOT is the horizontal output transistor, but if that failed it would have most likely taken out the fuse too, so it would be completely dead.
The 'winding down' noise you're getting is from the large filter capacitor discharging in the power supply. As I said in my PM, if you can remove your power supply board - or get someone to do it for you - I'm happy to send you one to test.

There are many circuit designs where a shorted HOT will not cause the main fuse to blow, I've repaired plenty of TVs that were built this way.

Ahh the joy of "real" electronics, not that SMD-throw-away-module you get in todays computers.

I wish you good luck in repairing your monitor, it's definitely worth it :-)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jay

Thanks hikey.

Car - ~£45 petrol
Train return - £73 :wooha:
Royal Mail - £40 (I don't have tons of faith in careful delivery of a fragile and heavy monitor).
hmmm.
PSU option sounds like it's the winner, even though there's no guarantee that's the prob.
Will PM you.
Thank you.

---

Hi Jay

Ive got a Philips CM8833 MK2 monitor here you could have on the condition you pick it up :) I read your thread and tested it so it works fine and youre welcome to have it. You will need to wedge a piece of plastic or card into the switch as it does not stay in the "on" position most of the time (a common fault) but it work great as can be seen in the pic.

You will need the power lead (standard kettle lead) and either an RGB lead or standard RCA lead (red,yellow,white AV lead you most likely have no doubt).

Let me know whether you want it or not :thumbsup:

Taj

this is one of the best monitors IMHO it can use a 23d-sub -> 9d-sub cable.
gives a fantastic picture.

and it's truly a great gift tajmaster parts with :bowdown::bowdown::bowdown:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tomse

this is one of the best monitors IMHO it can use a 23d-sub -> 9d-sub cable.
gives a fantastic picture.

and it's truly a great gift tajmaster parts with :bowdown::bowdown::bowdown:

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Indeed it is a briliant monitor, I have 2 (of which this is one) and my dad used to use them for the CCTV at his place for years.

The RGB cable shouldnt be hard to find via Amibay, if I had a spare Id pass it on but luckily the monitor also has the standard composite port for video so you can use a common as muck lead to connect it up to whatever old skool console you like :) (if it has composite out of course!LOL!)

Hey thanks Tajmaster. You are most kind.
I have a working PSU board on it's way to me which I'm going to replace with the existing one in my 1084S. I hope that works, but if not I would drive up to Bradford like a shot (if it's still available ofc).
Thank you.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jay

Hey thanks Tajmaster. You are most kind.
I have a working PSU board on it's way to me which I'm going to replace with the existing one in my 1084S. I hope that works, but if not I would drive up to Bradford like a shot (if it's still available ofc).
Thank you.

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Youre welcome mate :) Just PM me if you need it, I have no intenetion of listing it to sell as I cant be arsed with posting a monitor! lol :D

@ Tajmaster

If Jay's not up for that monitor, I could be... :whistle:

I could pick up from yours if need be.

Have a think about it and let me know.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Merlin

@ Tajmaster

If Jay's not up for that monitor, I could be... :whistle:

I could pick up from yours if need be.

Have a think about it and let me know.

---

If Jays PSU replacement works out and he doesnt need it youre welcome to it Merlin :thumbsup:

OK Taj, thanks.

We'll wait until we get feedback from Jay that his monitor is fixed before arranging anything.

@ Jay

For the Philips chassis monitor, like yours the LOPT fault is a 90% standard de facto. The <<small>> horizontal transformer, short his windings and the result is this fine pitch noise.

Ok, my offer is the above. If you can remove your pcb and send to me, I can check that for you, and after a look for what it need for spares only, I can send you back repaired only for that cost. :)

From a recent transfer from Germany, it cost me only 10 euros. The same I believe it will cost and your own.

Friendly Panos.;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by psodas

@ Jay

For the Philips chassis monitor, like yours the LOPT fault is a 90% standard de facto. The <<small>> horizontal transformer, short his windings and the result is this fine pitch noise.

Ok, my offer is the above. If you can remove your pcb and send to me, I can check that for you, and after a look for what it need for spares only, I can send you back repaired only for that cost. :)

From a recent transfer from Germany, it cost me only 10 euros. The same I believe it will cost and your own.

Friendly Panos.;)

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I've got a working, tested PSU board (the same horizontal board you're talking about I believe) on it's way to me from hikey atm. I'm gonna replace that and cross my fingerz, legs and all that jazz and hope that that sorts the problem thanks m8.

---------- Post added at 05:32 ---------- Previous post was at 05:07 ----------

I gotta give a big shout out to these proper monitors. The 1084S does/did a marvellous job for me, plus it's good that I can have my C64 and Amiga connected at the same time... and the colours are/were really good. I'm an analogue man at heart! Used to run a night called All Things Electric where I also DJ'd... was all about fat organic electronic analogue sounds.

Bedroom studio gear atm:
Roland SH09, RS09, TR808, TR606, TR727, Korg MS20, X0Xb0X, Casio FZ-1 x 2, Yamaha DX9, Sequential TOM (broken), Roland MC-4, Roland CSQ-100, Korg MS02, DBX 118, DBX 119, DBX 120A, DBX 386, Lexicon PCM 70, Lexicon LXP-1, UREI/JBL 7110 x2, Alesis 3630, Akai MPC 2500, Kenton Pro 4, 7 Nintendo gameboys, LSDJ, Circuit bent Speak and Spell, Voice changing megaphone (soon to be circuit bent), Boss DD5, Boss DS-1, EHX LPB-1, Ibanez FL9 Flanger, Allen & Heath GS3 24 track mixing desk, Mackie Onyx 1220, 5 breadbin C64's (feedback and output mod on one), 3 C64C's, C128, 1541U, Datel c64 midi cart, 2 Amiga 1200's (one with CF HD and pcmcia CF adapter. Blizzard 1230 MKIII 30/50 32mb ram on it's way to me right now), GVP DSS8+ sampler, Midi Master interface, Amiga 500, RME Fireface 800

I love my hardware :P

But I got made redundant so I'm skint atm :Doh:

The real thing is always better than emulation. The convenience of emulation doesn't make up for the final result IMO... especially when it comes to sound.

I guess this is somewhat of a slightly belated "HI ALL" post from a new Amibay user.

Hi :)

Jim

@Jay

Ok Jim, if all goes well you something hope:), and want to sell the damaged main board, I am interest.

Hey all..

Nope it still doesn't work. I fitted a whole new PSU board but my 1084S has exactly the same faults :(

So, if that offer still stands I'd love to come pick up that monitor please Tajmaster :)

Name a day/ time and I'll drive up, thanks.

p.s. I just received my first ever accelerator card in the mail today... a Blizzard MkIII 30/50 with 32 mb RAM.
I couldn't get it to work.... just black screened the compy, until I saw that the 60Mhz (yes! 60 Mhz oO) oscillator was oriented incorrectly.
I put the crystal into the board the right way round and boom! it works fine :)
Mips-10.84
Dhrystones-10394
CPU/Mhz-66.00 (oo-er)

How long is this CPU gonna last at this overclock?
CPU is MC68030RC50C.

Off-topic... just happy it works I guess... been running amiga from composite out into Gamei gamebox.. Looks absolutely awful.. Can hardly make out text.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by hikey

People always jump on the 'broken flyback' bandwagon on these
monitors, but in all the years i've been repairing them
i've rarely seen a bad flyback. If it is one of these 1084's:
http://www.amiga-resistance.info/download_photos/1084S-P_1.JPG
It's quite common for the PSU board to develop a fault which
causes the whining noise you've got.
If you get stuck, i could repair it for you but you'd need to ship
it to Bristol; or i could offer a refurbished exchange unit, I
have a whole selection of various 1084 monitors available.
If you do want to try and repair it yourself, the PSU board is quite easy to remove. I have spare PSU boards available also (but i'd want your faulty/suspect one sent back to me)

---

I have a Philips CM8833 Mk2 monitor here that whistles as if the flyback has gone South as you describe. If I ship the board to you, could you possibly repair it? If so, Please PM me some deets and I'll pack the board up for shipping.

Thanks

@Jay: glue a heatsink over the CPU & FPU (you can scavenge one from north & southbriges from PC boards) and add a fan and will be fine.

I use to have a Microbotics MBX1230 with a 56MHz crystal running absolutely fine (just the CPU crystal) and it was awesome for a "simple" 030 board.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jay

Hey all..

Nope it still doesn't work. I fitted a whole new PSU board but my 1084S has exactly the same faults :(

So, if that offer still stands I'd love to come pick up that monitor please Tajmaster :)

Name a day/ time and I'll drive up, thanks.

p.s. I just received my first ever accelerator card in the mail today... a Blizzard MkIII 30/50 with 32 mb RAM.
I couldn't get it to work.... just black screened the compy, until I saw that the 60Mhz (yes! 60 Mhz oO) oscillator was oriented incorrectly.
I put the crystal into the board the right way round and boom! it works fine :)
Mips-10.84
Dhrystones-10394
CPU/Mhz-66.00 (oo-er)

How long is this CPU gonna last at this overclock?
CPU is MC68030RC50C.

Off-topic... just happy it works I guess... been running amiga from composite out into Gamei gamebox.. Looks absolutely awful.. Can hardly make out text.

---

Hi Jay

Send me a PM mate with your mobile number and Ill give you a call to discuss :)

Taj

I have arranged with Jay to come pickup my monitor tomorrow :thumbsup:

@ Merlin

Soz mate, if I get another monitor I will let you have first dibs at it :)

Marvellous! Fantastic! Top bloke Taj :)

Screen looks gorgeous too, even just using composite.

Top one, nice one, sorted :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Going to fit that 50Mhz oscillator that you gave me too, so my desk doesn't melt :P

Thanks immensely :bowdown:

Glad to have helped out Jay :thumbsup::thumbsup:

Dont forget to put a wanted ad for the RGB>Amiga lead for the Philips mate :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by UberFreak

There are many circuit designs where a shorted HOT will not cause the main fuse to blow.

---

Agreed. Pays to know the equipment correctly.

Making assumptions and swapping out components is not proficient practice as shown in this case.

For the sake of postage has proved non-productive. :thumbsdown:

If/when/assumed a module is not functioning 100% then you can be sure it will be stressing elsewhere.

These issues would be picked up and rectified through a methodical complete full analysis; saving time, money, embarrassment and customer frustration.

A purist could argue swapping modules unbalances the harmony, as the replacement is operating with better efficiency vs the aged/ untested components so may potentially induce stress and shorten life
which equates to further repairs. (Worst case damage the replaced module too). :-o

"Module swapping" is a trend of Field Engineers conditioned by time constraints and modern practices. :roll:

Regards,

JetSet.

Here's a probably sill question.
Is there anything that can be done, preventatively, to make a monitor failure much less likely?

Blowing out the dust from time to time?
Checking/replacing certain parts from time to time?
Not using hi-res interlace modes? :-) (i.e. or frequent mode flipping?)
Line conditioners?

I know my 1084S back in the day died (no pic, whine) after about 4-5 years, but other people have had theirs run for years..
(I haven't had any other monitors/TVs die, so it was probably just bad/unlucky build, but???)

Just wondering.. If/when I get another, I'd like to do what I can to keep it alive.. ;-)

desiv

Quote:

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Originally Posted by desiv

Here's a probably sill question.
Is there anything that can be done, preventatively, to make a monitor failure much less likely?

Blowing out the dust from time to time?
Checking/replacing certain parts from time to time?
Not using hi-res interlace modes? :-) (i.e. or frequent mode flipping?)
Line conditioners?

I know my 1084S back in the day died (no pic, whine) after about 4-5 years, but other people have had theirs run for years..
(I haven't had any other monitors/TVs die, so it was probably just bad/unlucky build, but???)

Just wondering.. If/when I get another, I'd like to do what I can to keep it alive.. ;-)

desiv

---

Hello desiv, :cool:

It's not a silly to ask, the fact you've enquired makes it a positive question, informative for all interested to know and wishing to care for their CRTs.

There's no definite long/short anwser/solution.

Removing the dust and distancing the CRT from humidity (kettle/cooker/microwave steam/showers) reduces the risk of shorts.

Certainly periodically checks would help highlight and isolate any potential faults, may reduce greater damage incurred.

The "higher" resolutions obviously make the CRT work harder as you're aware of.

Interlace simply refers to the very fundamentals of TV characteristics.

But in terms of those characteristics, in order for the CRT to display "more" information means it will work harder within those parameters (hence why the 'flicker' begins to appear more apparent to the human eye).

Keep in mind the contrast level (in-short: voltage/ electrons vs phosphor wear, static images) vs performances parameters mentioned above. (Sometimes audible buzzing).

If the CRT specifications state capable of the modes you're using then use them as tolerances /overheads are factored into the design. [Though natural component age will compromise those initial standards - so be gentle :thumbsup: ).

As for "Line conditioners" entirely up to you. The "power board" within your CRT will have basic components that are responsible to filtering, smoothing and regulating/rectifying voltage. Unless your mains are chronic (which I doubt; by law) or the occasional microwave/kettle/old fridge motor/too long extension cable/etc usage causes issues I wouldn't bother.

Just common sense really as you've already pointed out.

Hopefully more people can contribute to your question.

All the best,

JetSet.

PS: Between painting at the moment so slightly incoherent from fumes. :blink:

(These two chaps have been going strong for more than 25 years with barely a service between them other than minor issues.)

Early 1084 monitors are not grounded and if you connect one to your Amiga you can see little sparks flying to the RGB connector if both are on and your connecting the rgb cable.

So a good thing would be to turn them off before doing so.
I've already grounded one 1084 I have, so I modified it myself.
Had the same problem, high pitch whine noise and that was my original monitor that I bought in 1991 and it was not grounded at that time because it simply doesn't come with a powercord that has ground, maybe if I had done that, my 1084 would be alive now, but I'll never know what happend.

As I have about 8 monitors, most of them 1084 and Philips 8833's, I don't think it's going to be a problem.
But after a while it's just over, I don't expect these things to see 2020, I hope they do.

I'm trying to get more Indivisions, but it certainly is going slow.

Add heat dissipation to the list. Surprising how many people stack VCRs/Books/Magazines etc even sleeping cats on top of monitors - creating an internal CRT furance.

Plenty of air flow.

Buzzfuzz made a very good point about adjusting the RGB cable when computer/monitor are on can also damage the tiny circuitry inside your Amiga video port as this carries voltage aswell as video data.

Keep speakers (magnetics) away from the monitor if neither are "shielded" with appropriate protection. This will crucify any tube sometimes irreparable.

Be careful with "non-standard" screenmodes (this isn't a jibe at Amiga video standards). The parameters within the mode maybe outside of the capabilities of the monitor - So when it attempts to sync and build frame could bork something.

JetSet.

1084 commandments:

-Don't let your cat sleep over it;

-Shave the cat so no fur inside the monitor (or the Amiga, for that matter); :)

-Open and do a thorough check on the main capacitor and LOPT (aka flyback) for bulging and cracks;

-Take the chance and dust it out;

-Use nail varnish on the bin of the flyback (after dusted it out with a dry soft cloth);

-Repeat each 2 years.

BTW: albeit the flyback transformers are outrageously expensive on Europe (at least the ones for Daewoo models; Philips units are not overpriced), that's the most common cause of failure on 1084 monitors.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rkauer

1084 commandments:

-Don't let your cat sleep over it;

-Shave the cat so no fur inside the monitor (or the Amiga, for that matter); :)

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Hilarious! I knew someone would make a joke about the cat sleeping on the monitor! :D

Bravo rkauer :thumbsup:

Don't allow your cat to sleep inside the monitor.

Turn the monitor on and the cat never will sleep over it again! Or sleep on anything, for that matter.

Barbecue, anyone?

Only cats...? :blink:

Attachment 6622

scnr :run:

LOL + OMG & hehehehehehheheheh

no not shaveing my pussy but then again she dos`t go anywhere near my monitors

Quote:

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Originally Posted by skippyar

Don't allow your cat to sleep inside the monitor.

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LOL... nice one... I have exactly the same cat (different colour); it's fake. :)

Oh dear, what's happened to this thread; haha.

What on earth is that thing anyway; Buster Gonad relative?

JetSet.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Phantom

Quote:

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Originally Posted by skippyar

Don't allow your cat to sleep inside the monitor.

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LOL... nice one... I have exactly the same cat (different colour); it's fake. :)

---

Here he is again having a little nap.

There are quite realistic.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by skippyar

Oh dear, what's happened to this thread; haha.

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:p

Well to bring this on topic, i sent yesterday one of my 1084s (1084s-p1, Philips i think) to a TV repair guy, it had the exact same symptoms of jay's.
I will post the result of the repair (...or not) here.

Also have a working 1084s-D1 (this one is Daewo) witch is been my first and trusted 1084 monitor for ages but is starting to give up, some 0,5cm size on top of the image gets slightly shifted to the left after some time on (any thoughts on the origin of the probem?? :ninja: thread hijacked :run: ).

Both monitors had / have a perfect image in therms of color and sharpness, also sound is very good.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rkauer

-Shave the cat so no fur inside the monitor (or the Amiga, for that matter); :)

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I guess this is also applicable to Squirrels?

"Could I interest you in a shave, Sir."

"0,5cm size on top of the image gets slightly shifted to the left after some time on"

@JLPedro

Are you able to supply a photo of the affected CRT?

1. You've not reduced the Vertical height to show the overscan/offscreen lines?

2. Does it shift in a *pulsing periodical fashion or does it just stay like that all the time?

3. Is it particular to any screenmode or all; if so which.

4. Input video connectors good?

Don't quote me, if I hazzard a guess I'd be incline to think it was a *Horizontal issue developing if it's no.2 above. If it's "moving" then most likely a sync fault related to a component.

Could really do with seeing it in action. :ninja:

If later it creeps down the screen or the whole screen begins doing it then it's definately a Horizontal fault. It might be worth checking the Neckboard and SCREEN too. (The image will look like a series of 'SAWTOOTH' sinewaves. Quite like the edge of a sawblade.)

Other than that it might be a BACK/FRONT porch LINE/FIELD SYNC issue. :wooha:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JLPedro

Well to bring this on topic, i sent yesterday one of my 1084s (1084s-p1, Philips i think) to a TV repair guy, it had the exact same symptoms of jay's.
I will post the result of the repair (...or not) here.

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High pitch sound means the flyback had go shorted inside and current is passing through the horizontal transistor (which will be dead, now). Both parts are easy to find and cheap.

Quote:

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Also have a working 1084s-D1 (this one is Daewo) witch is been my first and trusted 1084 monitor for ages but is starting to give up, some 0,5cm size on top of the image gets slightly shifted to the left after some time on (any thoughts on the origin of the problem??

---

Normally this means bad electrolytic capacitors (the small ones). Also check the vertical controller chip.

Here are some examples, I've deliberately faulted this TV to simulate the above mentioned.

As you can see the frame begins to pulse (tear top) then in the second photo sync is lost.

@ Skippyar

"Impressive, most impressive...." :thumbsup:

@ rkauer

Could you post a picture of the circuit board and highlight the flyback and transistor you mention? I have a CM8833 Mk2 with the whistling / no picture issue and I'd like to repair it.

Bad sync. Replace the syncing chip and check the capacitors.

Sometimes refluxing the solder pads fix the problem.

@Merlin: the flyback is the LOPT (line output power transformer), you can't miss it.

It is the big back thing with lots of pins on the under side (10 or more). The horizontal transistor is very near it, mounted in a heat dissipater and can be swapped for any modern transistor intended for horizontal circuit.

Original flyback for Philips monitors are AT2079, HR replacement is HR7506.

I'll check my schematics collection and post both circuits later. The CM8833 is the very same board as the 1084SP, with the same components.

@skippyar

It's like on the first picture but less lines and not so accentuated, not sure if it is on all screen modes as i only use it to play Amiga games.