How can u see when a game is NTSC or PAL for C64 games when u can't find it on the box?

Krid

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Hello there,

I'm new to this site after looking for C64/Amiga/CD32 information. When i was unboxing my old games. I have got so many C64 games most of them are tape games. But i also have new in seal Maniac Mansion/Night Shift(also for Amiga and that version say's NTSC version, but the C64 version i can not find it).

All the help is welcome.

Thx in advance.
 

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BLTCON0

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AmiBayer
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You can tell by 'feeling'. NTSC-specific means the program routines assume 60 frames per second and usually all graphics/sound timings are based on that. So if played on a PAL machine (50 frames per second) seems slower than would seem normal, it's probably an NTSC game. A reduction from 60 to 50 fps means an almost 20% slowdown so it's generally noticeable.
 

Krid

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You can tell by 'feeling'. NTSC-specific means the program routines assume 60 frames per second and usually all graphics/sound timings are based on that. So if played on a PAL machine (50 frames per second) seems slower than would seem normal, it's probably an NTSC game. A reduction from 60 to 50 fps means an almost 20% slowdown so it's generally noticeable.

Yes i know that, but i have some sealed C64 boxes and don't want to try them out ;-)

I thought that there were some problems when playing Pal versions on a NTSC machine. Not sure if there are any problems playing NTSC games on a PAL machine? Then not speaking about sound problems but games not working at all?
 
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BLTCON0

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AmiBayer
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Yes, PAL timings allow for more 'blank' time between consecutive display fields. So if a game has been written with PAL in mind, it may assume this extra time is available. If run under NTSC timings, aside from being sped-up by 20%, the catch is that the extra 'blank' time is no longer available. If the game runs at all, the usual symptom is graphical glitches.
If the game is simple/efficient enough that the extra 'blank' time isn't required, then you only notice the speed-up.

Since NTSC-specific games have been written without this extra time in mind, they can generally run OK in PAL, just slower.
 

Krid

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Yes, PAL timings allow for more 'blank' time between consecutive display fields. So if a game has been written with PAL in mind, it may assume this extra time is available. If run under NTSC timings, aside from being sped-up by 20%, the catch is that the extra 'blank' time is no longer available. If the game runs at all, the usual symptom is graphical glitches.
If the game is simple/efficient enough that the extra 'blank' time isn't required, then you only notice the speed-up.

Since NTSC-specific games have been written without this extra time in mind, they can generally run OK in PAL, just slower.

Thx for your answer, but i don't wanne open for example these 2 games i have in seal Maniac Mansion and Night Shift i have mutch more in seal. Before i sell those games i rly need to know what versions they are. I dont want any complaints.
 

BLTCON0

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AmiBayer
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I wasn't actually replying to how you'll find out what it is but to your other, more theoretical, question (NTSC games on PAL systems).

Obviously you can't know.

Vulcan logic says here that the game (Night Shift in my example) is universal or at least is being sold as universal. Otherwise they ought to print it out, like on the Amiga version. Whether it's a PAL-native game that also plays OK (and faster) on NTSC systems or an NTSC-native game that plays fine (and slower) on PAL systems, you can't know. There's the off chance the game actually checks what kind of hardware it's being run on and adjusts its timings appropriately, i.e. it's a 2-in-1 version, truly universal.

Check the emulators scene for versions of the game. If you can't find differentiated ones, test the single one you can find on a cycle-exact C64 emulator that can do both PAL and NTSC (there must exist such ones) to determine how the game behaves in either environment.

I'm 100% confident the game is PAL/NTSC but can't of course know whether it runs natively under both environments or just 'accepts' one or the other. For such a disambiguation, you'll have to try and see.
 
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