Nothing beats original hardware
PiStorm--Thoughts?
- Thread starter stevepiatt
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Yes, but it gets so murky Watson. To me real hardware is real hardware with a 68K CPU. Once you replace the CPU, what is it then? ...especially when FPGA does such incredible job of emulating the custom chips.
The issue I have with both is livability. Many have noted how frustrating that PiStorm experience can be, I have no personal experience with it because while I enjoy a video about PiStorm I know it's not for me. That whole video output drama with it too to get RTG. The cleanliness of MISTer FPGA is just so impressive.
The issue I have with both is livability. Many have noted how frustrating that PiStorm experience can be, I have no personal experience with it because while I enjoy a video about PiStorm I know it's not for me. That whole video output drama with it too to get RTG. The cleanliness of MISTer FPGA is just so impressive.
So, the Vampire 4 Stand Alone is in same bucket for you as MISTer and UNamiga?
Well, here we could have a discussion about how you rank these, but being standalone FPGAs, they do belong in the same FPGA category.
Personally, I feel the versatility of the MISTer would put that device first. MISTer is excellent value for the feature set. The fact that it is widely used and has significant support and many excellent cores puts the FPGA hardware capability front and centre. By far the best utilization of FPGA and broadest compatibility.
UNAmiga would be second in my view, because of incredible value with the very low cost of entry for such an FPGA product, no additional things needed to run it and the fact that there are a few other cores available for it beside the Amiga core. Not nearly as many as for MISTer, but at least a few favourites beside just Amiga. Not to be overlooked included out of box DB9 support for Amiga mouse with the UNAmiga. You can truly make this like an Amiga quickly. BIG BONUS - the fact it was offered as a drop in Amiga 500 circuit board shape with all the obvious benefits and significant cost reduction to run it in an actual Amiga 500 case. As noted, all things add up to a killer value.
Vampire V4 standalone I rate last because it is by far the most expensive and least versatile. There is little doubt that running Amiga, this thing is faster than other FPGA solutions. Correct me if I'm wrong but the Cyclone V FPGA in the Vampire V4 (same FPGA as in the MISTer) cannot run other cores, is that right? ...meaning, you sacrifice all that FPGA capability. By all reports it's an excellent Amiga FPGA experience, but it is all it does. At which point I feel like I'd rather have an actual 1200 with a TF1230 - the real deal, because all the awesome FPGA capability of other hardware being replicated is no longer a feature of this FPGA. Correct me if I'm wrong on this point please.
Honestly Watson, I can't speak on it because I never used it, and never intend to. I never even ran Pimiga. For me, it's just not what I want from my Amiga...Amiga hardware and chips just become a peripheral to the host Pi.
I see videos with PiStorm in the unloved 1000s, and it makes me happy to see those machines benefit from such an update, even if I wish someone would reshape the ReLoaded 1200 motherboard to just drop-in fit in 1000s instead for a real 100% pure Amiga upgrade in the 1000s that started it all.
Please understand, this is just my personal preference. I know people enjoy the PiStorm setup very much. I've said number of times before, it's impressive that it was made to work.
I think the interesting discussion here with the PiStorm is really PiStorm vs. Vampire internal accelerators. Considering the capability of PiStorm and the similarity to the Vampire Amiga accelerator options, I feel like those two products are much more alike and PiStorm clearly a killer value in that comparison. I know Vampire is FPGA, but since it doesn't shapeshift (ha!) much outside of pretending to be an 68080, the shapeshifting FPGA function for the user is not really manifesting itself like it does in a MISTer for example. Hence why I feel the two (PiStorm and internal CPU Vampires) are truly quite alike products in the end. And the value of PiStorm is not to be overlooked in this comparison.
You need to distinguish Vampire V2 and Apollo V4. The latter is a replacement for most of the Amiga, the former is an accelerator which brings very fast CPU and very fast RTG, plus ethernet. The Vampire V2 is very compatible on my A1200 and i rank it the best Amiga accelerator i have ever owned. It is equivalent to 68060@50 * 4 and its RTG speed is awesome with maximalized bus access. Pity it does not exist for the A4000.
I try not to give ratings based on others experiances.
Running a pistorm32 with EMU68, purely setup as an accelerator board (cpu and fastram only), without all the bells and whistles, RTG and hardrives is a different experiance.
I tend to stay away from the ready made distros.
Running a pistorm32 with EMU68, purely setup as an accelerator board (cpu and fastram only), without all the bells and whistles, RTG and hardrives is a different experiance.
I tend to stay away from the ready made distros.
I had a recent change in my opinion of the PiStorm, while I feel that real hardware cannot be beat, it is also a lot more expensive. Recently I have had to sell off most of my Amiga hardware and expansions due to loss of work and home repairs. My A1200 is the only thing left and it had to lose its TF1260 as well, which I loved using. I`ve gotten used to the speed of the 060 and I can`t see myself having the money in the future for one again the way things are going but the PiStorm gives me hope that I can at least experience a fast experience on my A1200 without putting down too much money. With money being very tight for me the PiStorm has unexpectedly become of a lifeline for my Amiga computing.
@amifan, you're spot on with that point. If we were to look at value proposition, PiStorm is one heck of a piece of kit. I think I may have said before that a valid comparison would to PiStorm Vs. Vampire in terms of both not having a real 68K, and considering the value proposition of PiStorm and feature set, it is indeed hard to beat.
Also, sad to hear about your money challenges, but worry not - all that Amiga hardware will be waiting for you out here in the universe if you ever choose to buy it back, that is certain. We'll even recap it and clean it up for you.
You're in beautiful Japan, with so much amazing beauty around you, and the awesome Japanese culture. It has been a few years since my visit. Recently I learned that Japan is the only place that has ZIMA available, right now...today! ZIMA came out around the time Amiga 1200 just got released if memory serves me right, because I remember those days. Do you know what this means amifan? If you drink, you being in Japan can grab a fresh cool ZIMA - 1993 style, and not only rock your Amiga 1200 to the max, but you can taste a time when Commodore was still a legal existing corporation making fresh new Amigas! SO COOL. Only in Japan.
Also, sad to hear about your money challenges, but worry not - all that Amiga hardware will be waiting for you out here in the universe if you ever choose to buy it back, that is certain. We'll even recap it and clean it up for you.
You're in beautiful Japan, with so much amazing beauty around you, and the awesome Japanese culture. It has been a few years since my visit. Recently I learned that Japan is the only place that has ZIMA available, right now...today! ZIMA came out around the time Amiga 1200 just got released if memory serves me right, because I remember those days. Do you know what this means amifan? If you drink, you being in Japan can grab a fresh cool ZIMA - 1993 style, and not only rock your Amiga 1200 to the max, but you can taste a time when Commodore was still a legal existing corporation making fresh new Amigas! SO COOL. Only in Japan.
Have the views on PiStorm changed somewhat for people? I don't really care much about this whole "emulation vs real thing" argument, I find it tiresome and fruitless especially nowadays, but I do care very much for usability.
People keep talking about incompatibility. How bad is it really? Like with old games? I mean I would be sticking this in an A1200, it already would be, whether I had it stock or with a 030 or bigger, incompatible with old games, and relies on WHDLoad almost entirely for playing.
But I use the computer mostly for music-making with Protracker and Octamed, and also enjoy a spiffy fast interface when navigating Workbench.
I am not interested in RTG nonsense though. I would not use the HDMI output of the Pi at all, unless the passtrhough mode that was hinted at at some point comes thru.
I recently went through turning my A1200 stock again after being kinda tired of the 030 accelerator I had in it and pretty much unable to afford, ever, a 060 one, but this one gets tempting cost-wise, because I do miss having a shit-ton of Fast RAM and using the faster processor to replace the blitter on Workbench.
Anyway, can people forget about this whole "is it real or is it not" debate and talk a bit more about how incompatible or not is it? Post some real use scenarios if you will.
People keep talking about incompatibility. How bad is it really? Like with old games? I mean I would be sticking this in an A1200, it already would be, whether I had it stock or with a 030 or bigger, incompatible with old games, and relies on WHDLoad almost entirely for playing.
But I use the computer mostly for music-making with Protracker and Octamed, and also enjoy a spiffy fast interface when navigating Workbench.
I am not interested in RTG nonsense though. I would not use the HDMI output of the Pi at all, unless the passtrhough mode that was hinted at at some point comes thru.
I recently went through turning my A1200 stock again after being kinda tired of the 030 accelerator I had in it and pretty much unable to afford, ever, a 060 one, but this one gets tempting cost-wise, because I do miss having a shit-ton of Fast RAM and using the faster processor to replace the blitter on Workbench.
Anyway, can people forget about this whole "is it real or is it not" debate and talk a bit more about how incompatible or not is it? Post some real use scenarios if you will.
I am about to finally build my Pistorm32 lite A1200 setup to complete my range of powerful A1200s. Now is the right time. WiFi is working, the software has reached version 1.0 or more, WHDload is sorted out with a wrapper. Tremendous work has been done and it has advanced faster than anything else. The cherry on the cake will be the native video mode adapter through the cam port of the Pi (how clever!).
Until i taste myself the Pistorm, i still rate the Vampire V2 the best accelerator i own, followed by Warp1260, then Blizzard1260, TF1260 (used only for tests, not daily) and Apollo1260.
Each card have pros and cons but Vampire V2 has almost only pros.
Until i taste myself the Pistorm, i still rate the Vampire V2 the best accelerator i own, followed by Warp1260, then Blizzard1260, TF1260 (used only for tests, not daily) and Apollo1260.
Each card have pros and cons but Vampire V2 has almost only pros.
You know that old saying about opinion's....
I have one and like it, everything I have tried runs perfectly fine.
My advice is to try it for yourself. All you need is the pistorm32 adaptor and a raspberry, if you find it's not for you, you could easily make back the money spent.
If you do decide to try it, emu68 is the best option. Grab the latest 1.0 release form github.
github.com
I have one and like it, everything I have tried runs perfectly fine.
My advice is to try it for yourself. All you need is the pistorm32 adaptor and a raspberry, if you find it's not for you, you could easily make back the money spent.
If you do decide to try it, emu68 is the best option. Grab the latest 1.0 release form github.
Releases · michalsc/Emu68
M68K emulation for AArch64/AArch32. Contribute to michalsc/Emu68 development by creating an account on GitHub.
github.com
Thats the reason why i sold my Icedrake and keep my 1200 V2 because I believe the V2 Vampire is a superior product compared to the V4 and more compatible since it still retains the original chipset. I have high hopes for the PiStorm, as I think it has the potential to perform as well as, or even better than, the Vampire with some time for development. Both the Vampire and PiStorm aim to emulate the CPU while maintaining the rest of the system intact which is how an accelerator should act imho.
What does that mean exactly? A link or explanation would be appreciated.
Taken from the readme of WHDLoadWrapper:
It is my understanding that all discussion/support of the tool is happening on the PiStorm discord server.
The invitation to join on Discord is: https://discord.gg/fxWKNmEGNc
For those that are not active on Discord the latest version is available here: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1cgGJ7pGQTOL4VZXLp_IFwdjUrVWDI3Mw
It is my understanding that all discussion/support of the tool is happening on the PiStorm discord server.
The invitation to join on Discord is: https://discord.gg/fxWKNmEGNc
For those that are not active on Discord the latest version is available here: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1cgGJ7pGQTOL4VZXLp_IFwdjUrVWDI3Mw
Totally agree to that statement. Been an advocate of the Classic Accelerators, favouring the Phase 5 and DCE products just because for me they work. Although have had problems recently with a MK1 Cyberstorm, which I have now got around.You know that old saying about opinion's....
I have one and like it, everything I have tried runs perfectly fine.
My advice is to try it for yourself. All you need is the pistorm32 adaptor and a raspberry, if you find it's not for you, you could easily make back the money spent.
If you do decide to try it, emu68 is the best option. Grab the latest 1.0 release form github.
Releases · michalsc/Emu68
M68K emulation for AArch64/AArch32. Contribute to michalsc/Emu68 development by creating an account on GitHub.
Everyone harked on about the BFG9060 for the A4000. So I bought one. Boy was I disappointed with it. Like all new things you are a BETA tester. I was one of them with the BFG9060, wouldn’t work properly with a SCSI card etc… Sold it off in the end.
Vampire V2 for A600 and A1200. Yeah, again it was okay for me. Fast yes? Compatible? Somewhat. Do I still use one today? Sort of in a A1200 only. But use A4000’s more with classic setup’s. PiStorm32 was a bit of an err…Shall I wait a bit longer? Should I take the plunge? I did in the end last year. Do I enjoy the PiStorm32? I sure do! The speed and the work being done. No paying for a license if you want a core (Like the V2 Vampire debacle). The way updates are virtually out everyday. Now Wi-Fi compatibility and so on… Besides a lot cheaper than a Vampire! V2 is basically not really getting any updates. V4 yes it is, but ain’t paying the monies for one when a PiStorm with a Pi 4 is 1/3 of the price!
dkasten
New member
Been toying with Pistorm intensively over the past few days... Here's my take-aways:
1) It's wonderful to see solutions like these, even if they're imperfect.
2) Emu68 is ridiculously fast, but it's unstable/buggy. Eventually fails 100% of the time during RAM chip RAM tests using the latest Amiga Test Kit. I had to pull the whole thing out and test with my original 68000 in place to verify there wasn't an actual problem with the chip RAM, but rather the PiStorm.
3) Even as a former Linux admin of 20+ years, the lack of a downloadable/burnable ISO makes the normal Musashi-based approach of getting up and running a giant pain in the ass..
4) Ended up purchasing Roadshow. Documentation is terrible, but it works.
5) See Boing-ball's comment directly above... be prepared to be a beta tester.
1) It's wonderful to see solutions like these, even if they're imperfect.
2) Emu68 is ridiculously fast, but it's unstable/buggy. Eventually fails 100% of the time during RAM chip RAM tests using the latest Amiga Test Kit. I had to pull the whole thing out and test with my original 68000 in place to verify there wasn't an actual problem with the chip RAM, but rather the PiStorm.
3) Even as a former Linux admin of 20+ years, the lack of a downloadable/burnable ISO makes the normal Musashi-based approach of getting up and running a giant pain in the ass..
4) Ended up purchasing Roadshow. Documentation is terrible, but it works.
5) See Boing-ball's comment directly above... be prepared to be a beta tester.
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