Single Board Computers (PC) inside big box Amigas

[Xanxi]

I did use one with Pentium 233 MX a decade ago in my A2000 (had ISA and PCI but was using only ISA obviously, in one of the two last ISA slots of my mobo which had been upgraded to full 16 bit slots). Actually, it was unstable most of the time because the power consumption of the SBC was huge and along with all ISA and zorro slots full, plus accelerator floppy disks and harddrives, my A2000 PSU died from exhaustment not very long after.
Besides, you need to find a way to make both systems to speak to each other to make any sense. I used a Siamese system with an ISA Siamese controller, but it was not as fluent as a Commodore/Vortex bridgeboard.
Not sure i would liketo try again that way, but instead i would use the SBC on an ISA/PCI backlane as it was meant to be, and build a retrorig of its own.

​

 

[YouKnowWho]

Thanks. Its has VGA integrated into the chipset and some other connectors.

MIcKnvL, that PCA-6186-B1 is a really good card choice. Socket 478 Pentium 4, onboard AC-97 audio, it's a really complete SBC card choice. And you don't have to have it across 2 ports, and in case of an A4000, you could still use the Zorro slot potentially for something. Nice one. Thanks for sharing.

 

[MicKnvL]

MIcKnvL, that PCA-6186-B1 is a really good card choice. Socket 478 Pentium 4, onboard AC-97 audio, it's a really complete SBC card choice. And you don't have to have it across 2 ports, and in case of an A4000, you could still use the Zorro slot potentially for something. Nice one. Thanks for sharing.

To fit it in a4000 you need to remove zorro slot connectors or else it won't fit.

 

[YouKnowWho]

I did use one with Pentium 233 MX a decade ago in my A2000 (had ISA and PCI but was using only ISA obviously, in one of the two last ISA slots of my mobo which had been upgraded to full 16 bit slots). Actually, it was unstable most of the time because the power consumption of the SBC was huge and along with all ISA and zorro slots full, plus accelerator floppy disks and harddrives, my A2000 PSU died from exhaustment not very long after.
Besides, you need to find a way to make both systems to speak to each other to make any sense. I used a Siamese system with an ISA Siamese controller, but it was not as fluent as a Commodore/Vortex bridgeboard.
Not sure i would liketo try again that way, but instead i would use the SBC on an ISA/PCI backlane as it was meant to be, and build a retrorig of its own.

​

All good points. I've decided that the A4000 power supply will get an ATX upgrade for this to address the wattage needs. I'll keep the original one aside.

I learned that here was some 386i upgrade to the A2088. It was an ISA SBC card that connected somehow to the A2088, this allowed the bridging. I'm not sure I care that much about it. But perhaps at some point someone will reverse engineer this setup to allow some bridging between SBCs and Amiga. I'm not sure I care that much about this at this time to be perfectly honest. Choosing these boards is obviously a compromise, but in my view, you give the vintage Amiga another feature - it now is a retro Amiga and a retro PC in one box. Less space used, wasted, and you don't have to look at some grey box cheap CP case from 2000. Honestly, anyone with free ISA slots in their 2000, 3000, 4000...should. I mean, why not, right?

Here is that A2088 to 386 upgrade option. 1990, 386-SX 16Mhz was a 1500 DM upgrade. OUCH! (Lower left corner in ad image)

Roßmöller Handshake 386si - Amiga Hardware Database

Amiga Hardware Database - Roßmöller Handshake 386si

amiga.resource.cx

But again...it makes me wonder if a combination of A2088 and a more modern SBC can be made to function to give that bridging feature you note. And...how software dependant would it be?

 

[YouKnowWho]

To fit it in a4000 you need to remove zorro slot connectors or else it won't fit.

I decided that I'm going to trim off the PCI pins off right above the connector pin on the SBC card instead and then cover the Zorro slot with hard plastic for additional safety to avoid any potential contact being made.

I'm not hurting the Amiga 4000 for this!

 

[YouKnowWho]

Besides, you need to find a way to make both systems to speak to each other to make any sense. I used a Siamese system with an ISA Siamese controller, but it was not as fluent as a Commodore/Vortex bridgeboard.

You know what...if ISA devices see each other, would a SBC see the bridge board? I wonder....a XT running under a Pentium? If so, maybe the issue of bridging these SBCs between systems is not so complicated? Maybe it could be some type of network Zorro to ISA solution that would do the trick, thus opening a whole world of highly capable PCs for the Amiga.

You install whatever SBC you want. You insert some "bridge board" that handles data movements between PC Amiga.

OR...how about a networking card on the Amiga, then connect the SBC to Amiga via network for data movement?

I mean...what else is needed, right?

And some of these SBCs have multiple ethernet connectors onboard already so you could have it piped into the Amiga ethernet card with a short cable and still wire to a network if wished.

....actually...why complicate things? Null modem.

Transfer files from PC to Amiga using a Null Modem Cable - AmigaLove

www.amigalove.com

...forgive the thinking out loud (on a forum).

 

[YouKnowWho]

Thanks. Its has VGA integrated into the chipset and some other connectors.

MicKnvL, I couldn't help myself. I picked up one of these 6186 boards like yours. It's a SWEET choice you've made choosing this one.

 

[Timtheloon]

onboard AC-97 audio,

Just so your aware the Audio requires an additional addon module

 

[MicKnvL]

I don't have audio on my sbc. That's why i have the AWE64 Gold. It only fits on the a4000 daughterboard if you remove 2 zorro connectors.

 

[Xanxi]

Those A4000 stripped from their Zorro slots are dangerously becoming to look like mere PC. I see bridgeboarding as a bonus but won't sacrifice Amiga organs for it.

 

[YouKnowWho]

I don't have audio on my sbc. That's why i have the AWE64 Gold. It only fits on the a4000 daughterboard if you remove 2 zorro connectors.

I'm standing firm on not molesting the Amiga for this project.

Plenty of ISA Audio card choices that firmly end on the last pin of the ISA slot and don't overhang to require space. Also, many more sound cards don't have anything if they run deeper than ISA slot. Finally I see a AWE64 on eBay that should fit in the ISA and not require removal of the Zorro III slot in the A4000. This one (photo attached) could even have the GBAPII++ card in the Zorro connector inline in same "slot" behind it to optimize space in the Amiga 4000.

It's workable. Thinking, planning, working through things. Worse case, I'll plug in a USB Sound card!

Hey MicKnvL, are you just reverse Y-splitter joining the audio signals from both to use one set of speakers? Or passing through the PC board?

And I'm trimming the PCI pins off the SBC card with an exacto knife as noted, right at the top of the slot connectors. Hope it works after! ...I'll experiment with another card first.

To Sum up:
-Null Modem cable is how we'll get Amiga and SBC to talk.
-Found some switching solutions, thinking Keyrah for using A4000 keyboard and joystick. May need to have 2 mice. Maybe I'll hook up two MicroSpeed trackballs AmTrac and PC-Trac next to each other - that will look gangster on the desktop
-Pondering if CD-Rom switching is even worth it, as it is way more useful on PC side and I can transfer files to Amiga.

Also...what the heck is this thing?

HiQ Siamese - Amiga Hardware Database

Amiga Hardware Database - HiQ Siamese

amiga.resource.cx

Xanxi, you have this Siamese thing installed and running?

 

[Xanxi]

I can't remember much by now but you can read the full story here https://www.amibay.com/threads/siamese-system-a2000-project.47997/#post-678037

 

[YouKnowWho]

I can't remember much by now but you can read the full story here https://www.amibay.com/threads/siamese-system-a2000-project.47997/#post-678037

Thanks Xanxi, will read in detail later today.

I know this is wishful thinking, but how amazing would a card be that could turn a MISTer into a bridgeboard-like device?

Where you could pop it open in a separate window on Workbench or pull down multitasking screen - something along those lines? All that emulation capability, including those those cores? Would be really something.

Maybe for now I'll squeeze one into the A4000 under the floppy drive somehow as a stand-alone but living in a killer case?

I'm all over the place here. I have AGA-A.D.D perhaps?

 

[YouKnowWho]

Hmmm...

If one of these SBC Pentium setups is running Windows XP, and XP has an MS-DOS option, wouldn't there be some way to make a A2088 board for example an accessory (drivers obviously would be needed) thus allowing a bridge back to the Amiga in some form as it was designed to do (storage/keyboard/etc.).

Wonder if anyone has tried this.

 

[StrongARM]

Good catch/idea.

Actually, for such opportunities, I still prefer my Acorn Risc PC with x86 card in the 2nd CPU slot. ;-)

 

[Timtheloon]

Hmmm...

If one of these SBC Pentium setups is running Windows XP, and XP has an MS-DOS option, wouldn't there be some way to make a A2088 board for example an accessory (drivers obviously would be needed) thus allowing a bridge back to the Amiga in some form as it was designed to do (storage/keyboard/etc.).

Wonder if anyone has tried this.

I think this would cause conflicts on the ISA bus two controllers on on bus.

I was thinking the goldengate II+ would do the job but it's only really designed to let the Amiga see certain ISA cards

 

[YouKnowWho]

I think this would cause conflicts on the ISA bus two controllers on on bus.

I was thinking the goldengate II+ would do the job but it's only really designed to let the Amiga see certain ISA cards

My thinking is that bridge boards essentially conducted traffic flow between two buses and perhaps provided a driver means to do it. Meaning, something has to be able to tap into the hardware on the Amiga side and present it to the PC like these utilities were essentially doing.

Such a solution would require minimal resources and complexity, and code could perhaps be inspired by hardware that already does this to an extent.

Your point about conflict of ISA controllers is absolutely spot on. This would need to be disabled on the A2088, so that it would become a device that would show itself as a board instead of seeing and controlling other ISA boards.

Such a board would be an incredible accessory to 2000/3000/4000 systems and open a huge world of PC emulation options, all the way to that monster dual Xeon SBC board I spotted and posted about above.

 

[Timtheloon]

Best get designing

Or maybe programming drivers for the goldengate II+ but from what I've seen these are extremely rare so designing from new is your best bet,

Here is a link to info on this unique bridgeboard it's not your usual bridgeboard

 

[YouKnowWho]

Best get designing

Or maybe programming drivers for the goldengate II+ but from what I've seen these are extremely rare so designing from new is your best bet,

Here is a link to info on this unique bridgeboard it's not your usual bridgeboard

Timtheloon, I did not know about this card! You are a wealth of knowledge on emulation Dude!

This is the card. This has to be the starting point, and it would have to be rebooted if it is rare. This thing looks the part, checks the boxes. No ISA bus controller to fight with the SBC, which you highlighted as an issue and obviously would be. It gives Amiga access to ISA, surely this has to allow going in both directions to allow access to Amiga hardware on the PC side.

This would be it!

We need Jim Drew on this project. He's the man behind Emplant, knows this are well, designed the board, software, etc.

How is paying <snip> £$€¥ for a 386/486 bridgeboard (today's going rates) better than paying <Snip> for this sort of "bridging-card" plus a SBC of choice? Everyone would be replacing their bridgeboards immediately! Slots permitting.

 

[Timtheloon]

I had to edit your price comment out because it not allowed on Amibay

I have a goldengate II+ but I've not got around to seeing what it can do I don't think it will take to the SBC because that was not what it was designed for so programming drivers would be needed and sadly this is not a strong point of mine (coding)

It would be a great device if created