To RECAP or NOT TO RECAP? That is THE question.

[YouKnowWho]

Local electronics and computer repair shop in business for well over 50 years says, "leave those capacitors alone unless function is impacted". Others say replace them all now, before they become an issue, even if this can potentially result in damage due to attempted repair. Others say capacitors reform over time. Others say just neutralize anything that escaped the capacitor with vinegar and let them be perhaps. Others say you don't even know how old the "new" capacitors you just bought are either...could be decade or two old already, they say.

Well, enough circling the drain. Let us keep it binary and solve this eternal problem once and for all, here and now.

So many capacitors, everywhere. Where do you stand? The cap is up end of January, when we face the vote capsequences.

 

[fitzsteve]

Something like an A500 I wouldn't touch unless there was an issue but A1200s, 4000s, CD32s, etc with surface mount caps I've seen the damage that old caps have done to boards already so on those machines it's a no brainer to preventatively replace.

 

[miggymad]

All my A1200's got a recap before they were powered up, irrespective if proven working at the time of purchase ... Prevention is 1000% better than waiting for the caps to leak in a closed environment.

 

[YouKnowWho]

@fitzsteve - how do you (or anyone) feel about those ceramic capacitors? They are quite fun and easy to solder in for starters.

 

[fitzsteve]

@fitzsteve - how do you (or anyone) feel about those ceramic capacitors? They are quite fun and easy to solder in for starters.

honestly I don't know enough to make a conclusion, I always just went for direct replacement good quality caps (not cheap china ones)

 

[HomeLate]

No, unless:
- SMD capacitors were used (Amiga 600/1200/4000/CD32/Macintosh Classics and beyond
- the analog board of certain Macintosh Classic models are know to leak and create havok on the other side of the PCB
- I once serviced an Apple Lisa 2/5 and it had failed caps on the analog board
- some Sony PSU's used in Macintosh SE's are known to fail because of failed caps (which leak)
- capacitors near bridge rectifiers can fail due to excessive heat or voltage spikes
- I once found a failed capacitor in a ZX Spectrum, but that's uncommon
- axial/radial capacitors from the capacitor plague era
- a specific capacitor in Apple IIe PSU's can fail (due to excessive heat in the area near the capacitor), causing a short on the 5v rail
- Amiga 1000/3000/4000, Atari ST(E)/(F), Mega ST/STE, ... PSU's. Don't bother recapping Amiga 500/600/1200 PSU's, it's better to get a new one
- Rifa's

Tantalum capacitors usually pop in old IBM (5150,...) systems and ISA-cards from that era. It's usually the 12v or -12v rail.

I serviced a lot of vintage computers over the years. I did find bad axial or radial caps in systems where I didn't expect to find a bad capacitor. Sinclair used the cheapest they could get on the market so these can fail over time.

I can't recall ever replacing a bad ceramic capacitor, unless damaged if someone dropped the part.

When I'm asked to recap a system when it's not necessary, I explain it's not necessary. I however proceed with a recap when someone really asks to do a recap.

 

[Buzzfuzz]

I have done a couple of A500's, but that is because these were pristine and never used properly, so I had it done mainly because they had been sitting still from the very beginning.
Call me crazy, but it's like you have a new car, it's still in it's breakin period and you haven't even reached the specific kilometers / miles and then you park it for 30 years

 

[darefail]

I have done a couple of A500's, but that is because these were pristine and never used properly, so I had it done mainly because they had been sitting still from the very beginning.
Call me crazy, but it's like you have a new car, it's still in it's breakin period and you haven't even reached the specific kilometers / miles and then you park it for 30 years

Only ceramic capacitors are ok after 30 years when they have been unused.

 

[ghaleon]

Depends!

With my vintage studio gear, its usually good practice to replace caps on power rails or PSU sections. Audio caps are USUALLY fine, but I've seen a ton of caps leak in the audio path as well. Certain pieces of gear are notorious for the caps to go bad, and in those cases a total recap is almost essential if you want to keep them problem free. I'm mostly referring to through hole electrolytics - I was taught that newer caps are smaller, with better specs than old caps in the vast majority of cases.

In amiga land, an A1200 is an absolute no brainer to fully recap IMO. History tells us that they develop problems with leaking caps, and every single one Ive come across has eventually had problems due to leaking SMD's. IMO they are ticking timebombs!

 

[DarkHood]

I got a 2000 (1500 rebadge) as
Well as a cd32 and to be honest I wonder about getting them recapped myself (I’m worried about a bodge job or waiting an age for completion)

 

[YouKnowWho]

@ghaleon - I once opened a Technics cassette deck thinking...I'll give the thing new caps all around. Opened it. Saw dozen-dozens of caps. Closed it. Forgot about it even having caps.

@DarkHood - bodge job indeed. Make no mistakes about it, Amiga have perished in recap attempts. I dare say, as many as have been saved...if only 5% of all Amiga made are left, as @Buzzfuzz suggested, with very decent logic. Recapping is like surgery - no guaranteed results.

 

[ghaleon]

@ghaleon - I once opened a Technics cassette deck thinking...I'll give the thing new caps all around. Opened it. Saw dozen-dozens of caps. Closed it. Forgot about it even having caps.

@DarkHood - bodge job indeed. Make no mistakes about it, Amiga have perished in recap attempts. I dare say, as many as have been saved...if only 5% of all Amiga made are left, as @Buzzfuzz suggested, with very decent logic. Recapping is like surgery - no guaranteed results.

some gear is easier to work on than others!

Theres a mixing board here in the studio, probably over 1000 caps replaced. Each channel is modular though, and the PCB's are very roomy. Everything is through hole. They are a joy to work on!

A tape deck is probably a good example of something that needs alot of disassembly and prep work. not fun

 

[YouKnowWho]

Someone noted that dabbing some vinegar around those SMDs as a preventative measure that can be taken without recapping. I thought it was a decent suggestion and compromise if you don't want to recap.

 

[fitzsteve]

Someone noted that dabbing some vinegar around those SMDs as a preventative measure that can be taken without recapping. I thought it was a decent suggestion and compromise if you don't want to recap.

Don't forget to clean away with a cotton swab of herbal tea. Then you should meditate or do yoga whilst the caps naturally heal

 

[miggymad]

@fitzsteve

Can't believe you missed out also having to play this at full volume, whilst sipping the remaining tea



And don't forget to buy the merchandise - See Dobbin the drummer afterwards

 

[YouKnowWho]

Don't forget to clean away with a cotton swab of herbal tea. Then you should meditate or do yoga whilst the caps naturally heal

YO! Homeocapathy!

You all know I'm the only "NO" vote to date, right? I mean, I need to start a campaign. Buy some ads or "NO" views/clicks from South Korea.

 

[darefail]

Don't forget to clean away with a cotton swab of herbal tea. Then you should meditate or do yoga whilst the caps naturally heal

How do you neutralise the leaking capacitor electrolyte that eats the ICs next to it every day? Leek soup?
Obviously vinegar/ipa does not replace changing capacitors in any case, but when we replace them it is good to clean the wider area.
And finally this poll is for the smd capacitors of the 1200.
When it comes to anything non Amiga/retro related or A500, we get a bit distracted for 40 years before we replace them.

 

[Buzzfuzz]

Someone noted that dabbing some vinegar around those SMDs as a preventative measure that can be taken without recapping. I thought it was a decent suggestion and compromise if you don't want to recap.

That won't work forever, it will eventually start eating the board
Just recap it for the love of God, I don't know why this is even a discussion

 

[YouKnowWho]

How do you neutralise the leaking capacitor electrolyte that eats the ICs next to it every day? Leek soup?

They're not that big. It won't leak forever. No one seems to like those "original" Commodore capacitors. No purists.

 

[Damion]

Original Commodore SMD caps have been a no-brainer replacement for 20+ years already. Several years ago I broke the warranty seals on both a NOS A600HD and a Petro A1200 and found minor leakage. Felt bad opening them up, but it had to be done - I have a small stack of A600 boards that are essentially ruined due to this issue (perhaps not, but would require more time and effort than I'm willing to spend resurrecting them, lots of ancillary damage). Sometimes issues pop up years after the caps have been replaced due to lingering electrolyte (A1200 audio circuit comes to mind).

Through hole caps in original PSUs get replaced here before I'll use them. Motherboards I'll usually spot check with an ESR meter, sometimes you'll find a bad one here or there, or as mentioned above there's a known series of defective ones. I've found that leaked electrolyte doesn't always wreak the kind of havoc you see from the SMD caps used by Commodore.

In principle I agree with the repair shop (don't do unnecessary surgery), unless previous experience dictates that preventative maintenance is the way to go. Same with car maintenance, tackle the known issue before it becomes an even bigger one.