Q:Commodore A3640 tinkering - Watch out I have boing balls!
- Thread starter arnljot
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Re: Q:Commodore A3640 tinkering - Watch out I have boing balls!
No "Too Bad" about it m8........
Doesnt matter a toss!. Just get the same 4 pins down to the same 4 pins on the board & you are good to go! - Trust me!! :mrgreen:
Kin
No "Too Bad" about it m8........
Doesnt matter a toss!. Just get the same 4 pins down to the same 4 pins on the board & you are good to go! - Trust me!! :mrgreen:
Kin
Re: Q:Commodore A3640 tinkering - Watch out I have boing balls!
Zetr0 is a legend in his own house RE H/W mods! - I aint so sure the card is good for 40Mhz period & a "try it & see it" thing is probably the best way to go.
I don't have a problem sending the Stuff to Zetr0, just so long as you understand it might not work, so maybe best to hold on any payments other than postage charges b4 we go tits up on this!?
What do you think Keith?
Charlie
Zetr0 is a legend in his own house RE H/W mods! - I aint so sure the card is good for 40Mhz period & a "try it & see it" thing is probably the best way to go.
I don't have a problem sending the Stuff to Zetr0, just so long as you understand it might not work, so maybe best to hold on any payments other than postage charges b4 we go tits up on this!?
What do you think Keith?
Charlie
Re: Q:Commodore A3640 tinkering - Watch out I have boing balls!
Excellent offer Kin Hell. If Zetr0 agrees I'll be happy as a clam.
I'll get a dil socket too for the mod? Also, if it was possible, I'd add some beers in the shipment to be had after the mod was done
Excellent offer Kin Hell. If Zetr0 agrees I'll be happy as a clam.
I'll get a dil socket too for the mod? Also, if it was possible, I'd add some beers in the shipment to be had after the mod was done
Re: Q:Commodore A3640 tinkering - Watch out I have boing balls!
No m8. You need this 14 Pin socket:
Google my "14-pin DIL socket" text for an eGay result @ £.xxp! :wink:
The sockets thereby this search means you retain the Pin pitches for your A3640 Card 1, 2 & 13 & 14 & press out the other pins bar 7 & 8 which should be snipped, as I kind of mention on my overclocking CSPPC thread. When you plug in the smaller Can X-Tal I have here as per your modded CSPPC card, just hot wire the snipped pins to the card (7 & 8 to 13 & 14 ) accordingly. It's the 5V package that is of all concern & pin orientation can be bent/twisted/conformed to what ever configuration you like, but please ensure physical orientation to the original socket is maintained what ever degree of twisting you apply!!
The other way around, I had a 14Pin X-Tal fitted to a 233Mhz CSPPC card I once owned. You know already these cards use an 8 pin socket. You ahve my Modded one to prove it! :mrgreen:
It'd be a whole pile easier to attain any socket & push out the pins as per my OC thread here on AmiBay! These pushed out pins can be soldered directly to the A3640 & don't believe the hype about such practises being worse than than a direct Solder. I sent you a Socketed/Over Clocked aka reversable 060 over-clocked CSPPC & I bet my bottom dollar, every time you switch X-Tals, ....it works first time! :wink:
Same goes for any card modded as I describe using an "Un-Soldered" X-tal in the first instance!
Stike me down if you aint already using 66Mhz as ur default speed!
Kin
arnljot said:
No m8. You need this 14 Pin socket:
Google my "14-pin DIL socket" text for an eGay result @ £.xxp! :wink:
The sockets thereby this search means you retain the Pin pitches for your A3640 Card 1, 2 & 13 & 14 & press out the other pins bar 7 & 8 which should be snipped, as I kind of mention on my overclocking CSPPC thread. When you plug in the smaller Can X-Tal I have here as per your modded CSPPC card, just hot wire the snipped pins to the card (7 & 8 to 13 & 14 ) accordingly. It's the 5V package that is of all concern & pin orientation can be bent/twisted/conformed to what ever configuration you like, but please ensure physical orientation to the original socket is maintained what ever degree of twisting you apply!!
The other way around, I had a 14Pin X-Tal fitted to a 233Mhz CSPPC card I once owned. You know already these cards use an 8 pin socket. You ahve my Modded one to prove it! :mrgreen:
It'd be a whole pile easier to attain any socket & push out the pins as per my OC thread here on AmiBay! These pushed out pins can be soldered directly to the A3640 & don't believe the hype about such practises being worse than than a direct Solder. I sent you a Socketed/Over Clocked aka reversable 060 over-clocked CSPPC & I bet my bottom dollar, every time you switch X-Tals, ....it works first time! :wink:
Same goes for any card modded as I describe using an "Un-Soldered" X-tal in the first instance!
Stike me down if you aint already using 66Mhz as ur default speed!
Kin
Re: Q:Commodore A3640 tinkering - Watch out I have boing balls!
Item 48-159-24 is just that, a 14 pin DIL socket. The picture is for a 24 pin socket. Only these are low profile. Do I need normal height ones - is it so that low profile sockets are not useable?
Item 48-130-69 on that site is an other alternative. Also 48-135-64 is a cheaper alternative, not low profile and in black plastic closer in resemblance to what´s on AmigaKit.
48-161-20 is the cheapest. But sell in 34 per pack. And is the kind that ICs goes into (two side contact in the socket). Same kind that ROMs go into, again 14 pin type.
When shipping is counted ordering from elfa is the fastest and simplest for me. Unless one of you have the component needed?
Item 48-159-24 is just that, a 14 pin DIL socket. The picture is for a 24 pin socket. Only these are low profile. Do I need normal height ones - is it so that low profile sockets are not useable?
Item 48-130-69 on that site is an other alternative. Also 48-135-64 is a cheaper alternative, not low profile and in black plastic closer in resemblance to what´s on AmigaKit.
48-161-20 is the cheapest. But sell in 34 per pack. And is the kind that ICs goes into (two side contact in the socket). Same kind that ROMs go into, again 14 pin type.
When shipping is counted ordering from elfa is the fastest and simplest for me. Unless one of you have the component needed?
Re: Q:Commodore A3640 tinkering - Watch out I have boing balls!
The reason for the delay line hack is when the board is running over 33MHz, what the original 3640 don't expect...
The hack is well known and absolutely recommended.
Kin Hell said:
The reason for the delay line hack is when the board is running over 33MHz, what the original 3640 don't expect...
The hack is well known and absolutely recommended.
Re: Q:Commodore A3640 tinkering - Watch out I have boing balls!
Sorry guys, but I totally agree with Kinny here: the CPU part will NOT make the difference. It's the fact that you're overclocking your motherboard that causes SUCK (aka. FAIL) to happen. And the chips on the A3640. You're driving the motherboard because you've set the EXT jumpers when using the A3640. Now, having said that, I know of one other guy (other than the .au link someone posted) that claims A3640@40Mhz working. I have tried 2 and neither go to 40Mhz (again, not the CPU, but the components on the mobo and the A3640 itself). So, if you do do it, make sure you cool the A3640 chips and the main mobo chips (let it run, once it's been up for a while, feel them and see which one is hot and put some paste and a heatsink on them).
One other big hint (thanks Jens Schoenfeld): the delay line chip is suspect to temporal and temperature related fatigue. After years it will not work as well which will eventually cause total malfunctioning of the board.
More info here (search for me posts):
http://www.amiga.org/modules/newbb/view ... 1222975265
@arnljot: I can almost guarantee 35-36Mhz will work, so let me know if you want a crystal that's in the ~70Mhz range.
Sorry guys, but I totally agree with Kinny here: the CPU part will NOT make the difference. It's the fact that you're overclocking your motherboard that causes SUCK (aka. FAIL) to happen. And the chips on the A3640. You're driving the motherboard because you've set the EXT jumpers when using the A3640. Now, having said that, I know of one other guy (other than the .au link someone posted) that claims A3640@40Mhz working. I have tried 2 and neither go to 40Mhz (again, not the CPU, but the components on the mobo and the A3640 itself). So, if you do do it, make sure you cool the A3640 chips and the main mobo chips (let it run, once it's been up for a while, feel them and see which one is hot and put some paste and a heatsink on them).
One other big hint (thanks Jens Schoenfeld): the delay line chip is suspect to temporal and temperature related fatigue. After years it will not work as well which will eventually cause total malfunctioning of the board.
More info here (search for me posts):
http://www.amiga.org/modules/newbb/view ... 1222975265
@arnljot: I can almost guarantee 35-36Mhz will work, so let me know if you want a crystal that's in the ~70Mhz range.
Kin Hell said:
Re: Q:Commodore A3640 tinkering - Watch out I have boing balls!
I feel my boing balls shrinking now
Reading from a.org I see that this will also affect the heat generated by my motherboard...
Will 33 to 35 also be a tough strain on the mobo, or will it be safer?
If so I think 35mhz on the 40mhz chip of Kinnie is the way to go? Then I need a 70mhz crystal.
I feel my boing balls shrinking now
Reading from a.org I see that this will also affect the heat generated by my motherboard...
Will 33 to 35 also be a tough strain on the mobo, or will it be safer?
If so I think 35mhz on the 40mhz chip of Kinnie is the way to go? Then I need a 70mhz crystal.
Re: Q:Commodore A3640 tinkering - Watch out I have boing balls!
33Mhz is dead easy & should be doable with most Full 040's. I have a used 66Mhz X-Tal here that was actually on my old A3640 back in the early 90's. Legs are a bit beat up now but she should be good for another solder sesh!
Still wouldn't hurt to fit a 40Mhz part & run it slower. Should be a littel cooler for it, heatsink or not! :wink:
@ da9000
Thanks for hearing me & confirming some of the stuff I read back in those pioneering days....
Kin
33Mhz is dead easy & should be doable with most Full 040's. I have a used 66Mhz X-Tal here that was actually on my old A3640 back in the early 90's. Legs are a bit beat up now but she should be good for another solder sesh!
Still wouldn't hurt to fit a 40Mhz part & run it slower. Should be a littel cooler for it, heatsink or not! :wink:
@ da9000
Thanks for hearing me & confirming some of the stuff I read back in those pioneering days....
Kin
Re: Q:Commodore A3640 tinkering - Watch out I have boing balls!
Probably edge values of the card architecture itself & possibly beyond most Stock 25Mhz 040's. One of those things you have to "suck to try" & whilst sucking to try, it could all melt down & pack in all together!? - One of the joy's of overclocking! :| :mrgreen:
Kin
Probably edge values of the card architecture itself & possibly beyond most Stock 25Mhz 040's. One of those things you have to "suck to try" & whilst sucking to try, it could all melt down & pack in all together!? - One of the joy's of overclocking! :| :mrgreen:
Kin
Re: Q:Commodore A3640 tinkering - Watch out I have boing balls!
Please keep in mind that I have no intention of having the 25mhz cpu overclocked. We are now talking about underclocking your 40mhz cpu.
What I'm wondering is the card it self (A3640) and it's effect on the motherboard. Will 35mhz be just as okay as 33mhz, or are those 2 extra mhz moving it too close to the edge?
Please keep in mind that I have no intention of having the 25mhz cpu overclocked. We are now talking about underclocking your 40mhz cpu.
What I'm wondering is the card it self (A3640) and it's effect on the motherboard. Will 35mhz be just as okay as 33mhz, or are those 2 extra mhz moving it too close to the edge?
Re: Q:Commodore A3640 tinkering - Watch out I have boing balls!
It's like this Arnljot....
Over-clocking any device is going to have consequences & the further you try to push things, the more consequential it is likely to go. For another 2Mhz, is it worth risking a burn-out?
I have a dead CSMKIII for a similar event if you want to try & convince yourself different! :wink:
Also, The Mobo will be fine because the timing is sent to the card & as da9000 already concurs, the architecture of the A3640 is very dodgy at these kind of speeds.
Running an 040 @ 33Mhz should yeild around 23.5 MIPS whereas a stock 25Mhz part would return approx 19 MIPS. It's almost like bolting an Extra 030 @ 25Mhz onto your 040!
Kin
It's like this Arnljot....
Over-clocking any device is going to have consequences & the further you try to push things, the more consequential it is likely to go. For another 2Mhz, is it worth risking a burn-out?
I have a dead CSMKIII for a similar event if you want to try & convince yourself different! :wink:
Also, The Mobo will be fine because the timing is sent to the card & as da9000 already concurs, the architecture of the A3640 is very dodgy at these kind of speeds.
Running an 040 @ 33Mhz should yeild around 23.5 MIPS whereas a stock 25Mhz part would return approx 19 MIPS. It's almost like bolting an Extra 030 @ 25Mhz onto your 040!
Kin
Re: Q:Commodore A3640 tinkering - Watch out I have boing balls!
Okay, I think I'm catching up now. Put me down if I'm not :-D
Now, my boing balls are in line. I agree, lets do the 33mhz frequency.
Now, if I only could get Zetr0 to also look at those Caps... :?
Okay, I think I'm catching up now. Put me down if I'm not :-D
- When increasing the frequency of a Commodore A3640 it's preferable to underclock a higher rated CPU than overclocking a cpu(running a 040@40 @33mhz is preferable to running a 040@25 @33mhz both in terms of heat and performance). I get the heat bit, but not the performance bit.[/*:m:2nmlvd5s]
- Say what ever you want about Commodore engineers but the A3640 is a piece of shit engineering?[/*:m:2nmlvd5s]
- The card is the bottle neck when frequency is increased. If it runs at 40mhz, the motherboard will generate extra heat too (SuperBuster, Ramsey, Alice, etc. jfr da9000@a.org)[/*:m:2nmlvd5s]
- If the card runs at 40mhz it will die faster (caps or other)[/*:m:2nmlvd5s]
Now, my boing balls are in line. I agree, lets do the 33mhz frequency.- Zetr0 will say "yea or nay"[/*:m:2nmlvd5s]
- Arnljot Will send postage to Kin Hell[/*:m:2nmlvd5s]
- Kin Hell will send Xtal(66mhz) and 040@40 mhz with fan and sink to Zetr0[/*:m:2nmlvd5s]
- Arnljot will send A3640 and DIL14 socket to Zetr0[/*:m:2nmlvd5s]
- Zetr0 will put it together[/*:m:2nmlvd5s]
- Arnljot owes Zetr0 bigtime, and sends postage money to him[/*:m:2nmlvd5s]
- Arnljot receives 33mhz A3640 card[/*:m:2nmlvd5s]
Now, if I only could get Zetr0 to also look at those Caps... :?