Bought a new computer

[Harrison]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Another reason to go ATI 4890!

 

[Kin Hell]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Another reason to go ATI 4890!

Yeah, if you want less than half the FPS of the GTX295.

Kin

*edit*

What size box is the biggest you want & what Mobo are you thinking on?? -Micro ATX? :stick:

 

[arnljot]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

What size box is the biggest you want & what Mobo are you thinking on?? -Micro ATX? :stick:

The Asus RampageII Gene is a mATX card. The whole point is that I want a small case and a small machine with a lot of punch. A big case is a HUGE no no.

The review at Guru3d says the card sucks up 25AMPs. The M12D has 40AMPs per 12V rail, so I should in theory be fine.

The only problem with the M12D is that it's reported to have very long cables, which might be a challenge in the sogo SG04b where space is at a premium.

I've studied airflow, the entire front of the SG04 is dedicated to sucking in air. It has an adjustable 120mm fan so I have faith that it should have a fighting change to stay cool.

Study the pictures of the SG04b and you'll see what I mean 1 2 3.

edit

Also, the xfx geforce gtx 295 I've picked is a single pcb card, only short comming it has is that the hdmi is by adapter and not native. That should mean no sound :-(

 

[Kin Hell]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

This case would do a far better job; It's Aluminium meaning about 10 degrees cooler including your hard drive/s; It's actually a bit cheaper then the Silverstone; The case design has a much more direct air flow.

Linky

Sure, it's a tad longer than the Silverstone, but at least the PSU gets located in a better spot & will help vent the heat from the top of the case. By comparison, the Silverstone fan has to suck air from the sides of the front panel; The PSU mount puts the PSU's fan only half way up the case & covers eveything you put in the box; It's got a nasty Steel chassis with a false Aluminium look to it via side panels & f'ugly facia. :flamethrower:

Just trying to help you get the best bang for your buck m8y. Hope you don't mind.

Charlie

 

[arnljot]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

@Kin Hell

Thanks, I appreciate that. And the Lian-li case you linked to there seems like a pretty little box!

Now in regards to aluminum cases, I have a bad experience with them (a lian-li box incidentially), they do make more noise than their steel counterparts. HD noise in my old case was bad. And using rubber screws/feet only acted as a thermal barrier for the HDs, so they ran much hotter.

From SilentPCReview:

ALUMINUM

The Aluminum Myth - Some favor aluminum cases, citing an ability to better cool components mounted within. This is a myth. No heat producing component benefit in any significant way from being inside an aluminum case. The only heat producing devices that are normally mounted in direct contact with a case are the drives, particularly the hard drives. The difference between aluminum and steel in this cooling function is insignificant.

This does not mean aluminum cases cannot be used to make a silent computer, just that there are disadvantages with them when compared to similarly constructed steel cases. Regardless, many aluminum cases certainly look nice.

The Aluminum Drawback - One consistent acoustic property seems unavoidable: Aluminum cases tend to pick up hard drive and fan vibrations more readily than steel cases, and make a higher pitched, more audible humming or buzzing sound. This quality is directly related to the density of aluminum: It has only about 30% of the density of the cheaper, more commonly used steel. Internally applied panel damping materials (especially the heavier kinds) appear to damp the resonance down fairly effectively, but it can be difficult and expensive to eliminate entirely. Internal supporting cross braces that effectively divide the large panels into smaller ones also help quite a lot because smaller panels are more rigid, stiffer, and less prone to lower frequency vibration than larger ones.

In the tweaktown review the guy is commenting on the PSU vs CPU placement in the SG04:

Fast forward a bit and I have most of the major components installed and the chassis wiring in place. The cooler for the CPU will accept a fan to aid in cooling, but due to the configuration of this chassis, there just isn’t any room. It will cool slightly passively, but the PSU fan will draw heat off of it, which you will see. Oh, and yes, that is a GTX 280 in there. With the right motherboard I could have even installed two of them for SLI or Crossfire horsepower.

Now he's using a stock clocked E6400 in that build, it's a processor which is reported to idle at 30 with the stock cooler. The Intel i7 950 idles at about ~35 to 40 degrees with a stock cooler.

I'm not going to passivly cool the CPU, and I'm also not using the stock cooler.

So I'm expecting it to be somewhat better. Also, overclocking in a SFF cabinet is out of the question!

I agree that the Lian-li case will have a much better airflow than the SilverStone sogo SG04b, but I'll give it a go first. And if I hit problems I'll swap it for the Lian-li case.

Since the local guy from Amiga.org stiffed me of money and a cabinet, I'm putting further investments on hold atm. BTW, if anyone wants to know who the crook is to avoid him, PM me and I'll share.

 

[Kin Hell]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

I appreciate the text you quoted, but I have to disagree with his comments. In fact, the first Lian Li I bought was my trusty PC70 Tower. That case replaced a "SuperMicro SC760-A" Server Case & my whole system was 10+ Deg C cooler. Air flow also plays a big part. Every case ever made should have a fan at the front. You just don't brick it up with hard drives. issed: If you do, space the drives & get a fan over them. Massive differece & the bigger, the better.

Just remember, in that Silverstone case, by the time you lash the PSU over the mobo, don't get any fancy ideas of fitting much to the CPU in terms of cooling. You be lucky to get a packet of fag papers on top of it. :jester:
Joking aside, the Lian Li case I showed you has rubber mounted hard drive rails & you will also be able to fit a decent CPU Cooler because the PSU is out of the way. As a matter of interest, what are you considering for cooling the CPU?

Kin

 

[arnljot]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

I appreciate the text you quoted, but I have to disagree with his comments. In fact, the first Lian Li I bought was my trusty PC70 Tower. That case replaced a "SuperMicro SC760-A" Server Case & my whole system was 10+ Deg C cooler. Air flow also plays a big part.

I think airlfow plays much more importance that the build material, as it's active vs passive. Now if we're talking purely about heatsinks, then I'm with you ;-)

Every case ever made should have a fan at the front. You just don't brick it up with hard drives. issed: If you do, space the drives & get a fan over them. Massive differece & the bigger, the better.

Agree, the SilverStone sogo SH04 doesn't have any drives, but a door.... LOL. Well, we've already covered this. The Lian-li is much smarter there. But I still think that I'd be able to cool the SH04 somewhat.

Just remember, in that Silverstone case, by the time you lash the PSU over the mobo, don't get any fancy ideas of fitting much to the CPU in terms of cooling.

See below :jester:

You be lucky to get a packet of fag papers on top of it. :jester:
Joking aside, the Lian Li case I showed you has rubber mounted hard drive rails & you will also be able to fit a decent CPU Cooler because the PSU is out of the way.

Yes, space is at a premium in any SFF case, but CPU cooler wise very much more so in the SilverStone sogo SH04b as it places the PSU right above the CPU. This leaves 82mm in height left for a CPU cooler. Not many "heavy duty" coolers fit that shoe...

As a matter of interest, what are you considering for cooling the CPU?

I'm planning on cooling it with the Scythe Big Shuriken. It comes highly reccomended to me. It is 58mm high.

 

[arnljot]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

First admission: There will not be a photo story of this build in the photobooth, sorry!

I was too tired to take snaps, so I just "threw it together".

Experiences so far:

1) The M12D PSU gets quite hot.
2) The CPU Idles at 47 degrees, and doesn't heat up much
3) Haven't gotten around to stress the GTX295 yet...
4) Asus drivers suck.
5) It's very tight due to long cables on the M12D

If cables on the PSU had been shorter it would be much better for me. I'll see if can use some strips and tidy up the cables, but I don't have much room to manuver.

Cables are not in the way of airflow of any major components (GPU/CPU), but could be in the way of a PCI card (Catweasel or Wifi).

Since the catweasel isn't 64bit driver, I was planning on running XP32bit virtualized with UAE, positive reports on the matter can be found on google.

Wifi wise... I think I'll be using cable, but I could consider buying a usb wifi dongle.

 

[arnljot]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

The sugo sg04bh supports holding the PSU in two different positions. Either sucking air off the CPU, or sucking it in from the side of the case.

I first thought it was a good idea to suck in air from the cpu, it wasn't. The cpu idles much cooler now, and the PSU doesn't get so hot.

It's kinda like a "doh!" oh: moment, as both fans (CPU/PSU) "suck", so they competed for air in the previous setup. Now the cpu fan can suck cold air onto the cpu from the front panel fan, and the PSU fan can suck air from the cold outside.

 

[Kin Hell]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Relying on any fan to suck is as bad as asking a bulldog for a blow job.
I could never understand why alot of manufacturers sold computers with CPU fans sucking the heat off the heatsink. That's just letting the CPU & Heatsink get as hot as it likes while the fan tries to take the heat away. You might as well not bother having a fan sucking at all & leave it to destroy itself passively.

RE Air flow in a case: Get as much air into the case as possible with some helping fans to draw out of the case. It's a balancing act really.

Kin

 

[arnljot]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

I just realised that my previous post was completely gobeligook.

What I meant to say is that the CPU fan suck air onto the cooler, or as one would normaly say: It blows.

The PSU fan suck air on the side, and blows it out in the back.

The way it was set up the psu sucked in air just above the cpu cooler, and the cpu fan sucked in air onto the cpu just beneath the psu.

Now, can anyone tell me what a hot north-bridge temp is for a X58 and a hot temp for a i7 950 is?

I've figured I need one more 120mm fan in the front. And maybe something that will suck out air in the back, if there is room for a fan LOL

 

[Kin Hell]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

I'm not sure I fully understand just what you mean now m8. Tell you what, enjoy the cooler temps & I'll have another beer for ya! int: :mrgreen:

RE: NB temps on X58, I have no idea. Have you tried looking on the Intel threads over @ Xtreme Systems ?

Kin

 

[arnljot]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

These illustrations are seen from the top of the chassis.

Alt 1: The way it can be:

Alt 2: The way it can be:

The way I run it now, added a 40mm fan in the back

I'll buy a bigger 92mm fan and add to the back, and add another 120mm to the front

Hopefully this makes it clear

 

[Kin Hell]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Talk about; Do ya need a picture Drawing!? - plicitly my dear friend. :nod:

When you get the extra 90mm & 120mm fans installed, I guess you're gunno be buying some ear defenders.

Charlie

 

[arnljot]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Talk about; Do ya need a picture Drawing!? - plicitly my dear friend. :nod:

Hehe, aren't my ms paint skillz awesome? Or is it my thick muppet accent that has you stumped? LOL

When you get the extra 90mm & 120mm fans installed, I guess you're gunno be buying some ear defenders.

Charlie

This is the one I'm picking up on monday.
http://www.akasa.com.tw/update.php?tpl= ... odel=AK-SB

They claim it's ~25dBA, which means that it's closer to 30. Still, the PSU is at ~25 and the GTX295 is ~32, haven't gotten around to make an accurate meassurement yet.

So that fan won't be a huge problem (keeping fingers x'ed!)

 

[Kin Hell]

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Re: Bought a new computer (WAS: Powerfull mATX PSU?)

Nothing wrong with block diagrams m8. Easy to see what is what. I can also understand your alleged thick Muppet accent, but I thought the closest Muppet to your country was the Swedish Chef.

Have you tried manually upping the GTX295 Fan speed? It's more like 60+db flat out. Work is already in hand to get mine under water.

The Extractor fan you show are usually quite noisey. It's the turbine like extractor inside the unit causing the howl like sound. :shock:

Kin