Modern Amiga PSUs: deeper than a rabbit hole!

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fpmpaolo

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Hello people, while I'm waiting to improve my MeanWell RT65B PSU, I managed to read lots and lots of info about modern PSU built by various companies.
As usual: the more I read the more I get confused :D

Did anyone buy Keelog PSU? Does anyone use ElectroWare PL PSU?
Some say the best is CA-PSU by Icomp, while some other are happy with MeanWell.
Purists would use a recapped original PSU.

What do you think about that? What are your opinions?
I'm curious!

Edit:
You only cut that one line to disable the potentiometer, which is tiny, a piece of crap, and causes more voltage issues than not. There are 4 connections, Input voltage, V-output, ground and EN for a positive voltage to enable something I've already forgotten as it wasn't applicable. Then solder a blob at the 12 V line and see if it gives you the 12 V measurements you desire. You can leave the potentiometer connected, and play with it to see why it's best left out of use.
 
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My two cents...

Steer clear of the Electroware PSU's if you plan to use a CD32 with a classic expansion (in my case a sx32pro), as it won't be powerful enough.

Their PSUs also have no short protection (-12v died on mine) - but Electroware was very helpful though in repairing it for a very small amount.

Since then, I have been on the look out for a better solution.

(I won't pay the license fees to unlock full watts on the CA-PSU, so that is definitely out of the question).

Do write what you settle on, I would interested to hear :)
 
I use the CA-PSU and Electroware PSU. My CD32 PSU from Electroware works with my TF360, SX32, TF328 and TF330. One time I blew up my CD32 with TF328, because I accidentally jumpered the Optional Power. The CA-PSU sometimes have a hard time to power an Amiga 1200 with IceDrake V4 or A600 with MantiCore V4. It had only 4.95 V on +5V. Other CA-PSU which has more Voltage had no problem.

I have blew up an A600 with an Original A500 PSU, because I used a USB to Joystick adapter. You need to be careful when connecting a USB adapters to Amiga.
The A600 mainboard has serious damage beyond repair and a friend of mine took the working chips to a new Amiga 600 Remake board.

I use a Keelog Amiga 500 PSU Tester to test unknown Amiga 500 PSU's.

I also own several Electroware PSU's for C64 and Amiga.

One tip I also give you is: If you use a lot of IComp product in your Amiga, then use a CA-PSU . The reason is if something is going wrong with a IComp product with other PSU except original ones , then IComp will blame you for using Aftermarket PSU's.

Instead of buying a third party PSU, you can also recap the PSU.
 
I agree, you can't claim to Jens that an IComp product is not working if you don't have a CA-PSU.

Nowadays, i only use 3 types of PSU :
- 2 PSU made by Mechy in the early 2010's which have strong 5V about 7 or 8 A and have been working great since i had them
- 2 CA PSU, 1 for my V2 1200 setup, 1 for tests
- 1 Powershark which is my on the go PSU.

Anything else i don't trust, especially old unserviced Commodore ones.
 
@screemo ATM I have a plain MeanWell RT6B and I'm waiting to get some DC-DC converter, and @8 Bit Dreams guide to install them on the rails.
IMHO it is a good and cheap homemade solution. And I can install it on an original Commodore PSU box.
I also have a recapped 1200 PSU, but I haven't tried it yet.

(I won't pay the license fees to unlock full watts on the CA-PSU, so that is definitely out of the question).
ARE YOU SERIOUS MAN? I know you have to pay license fees to unlock / overclock ACCELERATORS...do they do the same on PSUs? If so, I don't like this kind of marketing.

@awmosoft I have an A600 + Vampire + 1mb ChipRam + SD-IDE. I was about to to buy ElektroWare Boost PSU but I read about some failures on C64 reddit so I don't trust them much.

@Xanxi I'm waiting for the new PowerShark batch but it's veeeeeeeeeeery expensive IMHO.

So IHMO, up to know best solutions are the home-made PSU powered with MeanWell, and CA-PSU.
Do you people agree?
 
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@screemo

(I won't pay the license fees to unlock full watts on the CA-PSU, so that is definitely out of the question).
ARE YOU SERIOUS MAN? I know you have to pay license fees to unlock / overclock ACCELERATORS...do they do the same on PSUs? If so, I don't like this kind of marketing.

@Xanxi I'm waiting for the new PowerShark batch but it's veeeeeeeeeeery expensive IMHO.

So IHMO, up to know best solutions are the home-made PSU powered with MeanWell, and CA-PSU.
Do you people agree?

No he is joking about the license stuff (i don't like to pay licence fees for hardware either). Only fee you have to pay with the CA-PSU is to your electricity company, they are the one unlocking watts.

Powershark not that expensive considering the small fomr factor and huge versatility. And the EU has settled up for the USB C, so there will be USB PSU for a long time.
 
No he is joking about the license stuff (i don't like to pay licence fees for hardware either). Only fee you have to pay with the CA-PSU is to your electricity company, they are the one unlocking watts.
LOL I thought it was serious. We all know how iComp works don't we.

Powershark not that expensive considering the small fomr factor and huge versatility. And the EU has settled up for the USB C, so there will be USB PSU for a long time.
As far as I remember, the PowerShark was about 90EUR shipped to Italy.
A MeanWell would cost 30/35EUR shipped to Italy + 2/3EUR for the DC-DC converter...you have a modern and powerful PSU for half of the price you know.
Though it is very big...
 
I let me opinion shine through there on the IComp PSU argument ;)

....so what PSU should you really go get then ?

Had a look at the Keelog PSU, but they don't offer modular cables (like Electroware). So buying two PSU's because of that, is maybe a little unnecessary.

I did get a bunch of Delta PSUs which can be used for CD32, but I can't remember how powerful they are (doesn't have -12V btw).

With that in mind, just one Keelog for A5/6/1200 maybe?
 
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I use a MeanWell RT65B for sometime now inside a 3D printed case. It is connected to my A1200 with Blizzard 1230IV (CPU + FPU). Runs just fine. Recently measured with multimeter, it is rock steady.
 
I use a MeanWell RT65B for sometime now inside a 3D printed case. It is connected to my A1200 with Blizzard 1230IV (CPU + FPU). Runs just fine. Recently measured with multimeter, it is rock steady.
Did you solder some DC-DC converter on it?
I'm planning to setup one
 
This is a real issue, and these power supplies are getting expensive. More and more I'm leaning toward PC ATX.

I'm glad that the Checkmate1500 takes an SFX. Some other builds I've moved to 1U ATX power supplies as they are compact and do the trick. Fans run very very quiet, as in I have to check if they're spinning by feeling for breath. They're not showers, and I'm fortunate that some of the Amiga I bought came with European PSes, so I could take out the square connector cable for the final connection. I hide the 1U ATXs out of view or inside custom projects. Back of drawer with a remote switch, bracket under desk, etc.

Dream? I'd like to see new guts replacements for Commodore supplies. I was thinking of using ElectroWare PL PSU for guts, but like @sceemo noted, they have no short protection and I had one go while exploring due to my error. It made me question doing "projects" with them due to this sensitivity, so I'm careful and I don't mess with them. I see + and - 12V bricks out there, but not + and - 12V and 5V, which would do the trick. Going forward with prices inflating, it's not a bad idea to pick up an extra one of your choices now perhaps.
 
This is a real issue, and these power supplies are getting expensive. More and more I'm leaning toward PC ATX.

Some other builds I've moved to 1U ATX power supplies as they are compact and do the trick.
There's a PSX-Amiga board adapter on the famous auction site, but it's a little bit expensive IMHO.
Sorry but...What is a 1U atx psu? Something like that? A PSU from a server or a NAS?
 
@fpmpaolo - yes, exactly. They are compact and reasonable. I bought a few new and now I just grab them when they find me locally in surplus or PC shops to have an extra one always. As for the adapters, they can be but have their place. If you don't have the connector cable it is worth it. If you're worried about getting the wrong pins, it's worth it In the big-box systems too, those pre-built adapters are worth it for the cleanliness alone. Otherwise, I found this out there somewhere a while back, so sharing as FYI:
 

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All joking aside - for wedge Amigas I honestly find Jen’s CA-PSUs are really good.
 
A thought...perhaps someone can audit if this makes sense.

Since +/- 12V power supplies are available, what about taking one, combining it with a separate 5V PS under a single switch that switches both on. Would combining the 3 grounds be an issue?

For clarity put these inside your old Commodore case that had a broken PS or in my case 220V guts. Would it work?
<this 12V +/-> https://www.ebay.com/itm/313390296573 PLUS <that 5V 5A> https://www.ebay.com/itm/233232937904

EDIT April 13th - I guess this dual power supply idea is a bad one for voltage regulation reasons.
 
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I recently spent hours reading about and researching the Amiga PSU situation. First, I firmly believe that Jens has written a lot of valuable posts about the current state of affairs and he overall comes closest to accurately describing potential issues. Love him or hate him, you can't accuse him of grifting or taking advantage of people's ignorance. He's an electrical engineer by trade, has designed tons of excellent hardware for the Amiga, his forums are open for everyone to read, he goes out of his way not only to help people but also the community. Finally, his engineering mindset, hypothesis forming and root-cause analysis skillset is top-notch. The man is a hardcore engineer at heart. As a disclaimer, I don't have any special relationship with him besides being a repeat customer, what I wrote should become obvious to anyone that simply spends 20-30 minutes reading posts in his english support forum at icomp.de.

Now that said, here are the main issues with most widely sold MeanWell-based Amiga PSUs (Keelog, Electroware/c64psu, Retropower, A-Power etc) today:

1. There's excessive ripple (typically 80-100-120mV, Commodore specifies 50mV max). MeanWell RT-65B used to specify 50mV peak-to-peak ripple, but that changed as of a few years ago, and now none of their compact PSUs that I know of specify ripple below 80mV. Some folks at eab.abime.net have come up with additional LC (inductor and capacitor) filtering to bring the ripple in-spec, but that's not something easily done by most people.

2. There's no automatic voltage drop compensation which can lead to undervoltage that can damage modern 3.3V ICs. Some MeanWell supplies allow the user to manually tweak the 5V output but that's not a good solution either: It's static and doesn't change with load but it can also throw the 12V rail out of spec. There are some custom modifications that add load to the 12V rail but again that's not something easily done by most people.

3. The 12V rail is not regulated on any MeanWell compact supply typically used for Amiga PSUs. This means that voltage fluctuations can be wild, leading to component damage.

4. Modern ATX PSUs do all their regulation on the 12V rail, so if there's minimal load there which is always going to be the case with an Amiga, the 5V rail output will not be stable. Older AT (and maybe older ATX) PSUs are better in that regard, but given their age, would need to be reworked.

Which brings us to the vendors of these so-called "Amiga PSUs". The most charitable characterization for them IMV would be tinkerers that are looking to make a quick buck. Maybe a more accurate characterization would be charlatans or fraudsters that are taking advantage of people's ignorance. All one has to do is read the misleading marketing that they put out on their websites: None of them admit that they're simply taking a dirt-cheap off-the-shelf MeanWell supply that doesn't even meet the Commodore specifications and wrap it in a plastic case with cables whilst charging 3-4 times the price. Besides the ludicrous margins, there's zero engineering here.

Yet Google search consistently puts them on the front page of results and people keep buying their products. Best case, if you're running an unexpanded Amiga with old ICs that are less sensitive to ripple and undervoltage, maybe you're willing to take the risk of using one of these supplies. But personally, I've spent thousands of dollars building Amigas with modern accelerators and other components and falling for this outright grift and putting my systems at risk is not something I'm willing to do.

If you don't want to buy Jens's CA-PSU (that some might see as over-engineered, I own several and couldn't be happier), Jens himself has said that recapping an original Commodore PSU is a good alternative. Moreover, investigating DC-DC solutions like PicoPSU could also be another alternative.

I'm mainly writing this to summarize what I put together after hours of research and help others. Most folks have the wrong idea re: evaluating a PSU, it's not simply a matter of using a multimeter to measure output. Even if you measure voltages while the Amiga is running (e.g. on the floppy connector) that doesn't show ripple and it doesn't show how the PSU behaves dynamically (e.g. when you insert a floppy, spinup a hard-drive or a CD, plug in a USB stick).

Some references:

[1] Jen's slides for "Designing a better Amiga PSU" and video presentation
[2] Video presentation of the above
[3] Commodore PSU Specification
[4] Commodore vs Electroware (ripple measurement under load)
[5] Ian Stedman ATX PSU Guide (look at "minimum load" section)
 
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@atomontage - re. ATX PSU, is there a reliable way to stabilize the 5V? Dummy load? What would be ideal to ensure stable 5V? How big of a problem is this? This problem is on wedges or all also big-box that have an ATX power supply deployed on them?

Forgive the question, curious as a big fan of ATX and did not know about the potential issues. Finally, thank you for the detailed post.
 
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